A philosophical question on mileage and longevity

[oneafrikan]

Interested to hear everyone's thoughts on this one.

When you do your research online it really does feel like the 80 series has a fantastic reputation.
I grew up in and around Land Rovers my whole life until about 16, so I'm saying that as someone who grew up dreaming of owning a Camel Trophy vehicle, and the travel experiences to go along with it.
In the last 6 months of heavy research, I've been persuaded to change to a LC, and so I guess I'm asking the same kinds of questions that LR owners take for granted, and then spend their life fixing!

I called my local Toyota dealership to do a quick test, and guess what: the "technicians" there hadn't ever worked on a '94 turbo diesel; and then when I dropped off our Avensis for an MOT, all the people I met with and interacted with, including the two "technicians" were probably just under half my age. Would I trust them with our Cruiser? Never!

So the 80 series is getting old and feels like the people who really know enough about them to care enough to do a good job are thin on the ground.

I'd like to take our truck all over the UK & Europe, and as my son grows up (he's 1 years old now), all over the world. Ideally we'd like to do a RTW trip with him, either when he's old enough to do a year of home schooling, or just after he finishes school - so if we want to invest the money and time into the truck so that it will look after us through our experiences, what can we realistically expect from it? If one was to look 10 to 20 years ahead, would it be realistic to expect to be able to overland / keep using an 80 series '94 Diesel automatic?

Will parts still be available then? Will competent mechanics still be around then? Should I invest the time now in becoming mechanically competent, so that in the future we're covered? What kind of mileage can we realistically expect to get from an original engine? Do you keep the body and running gear as tip top as possible, then do an engine graft at some point in the future when rebuilding doesn't make sense? Who has the most mileage around here?

How is everyone else treating this? Is everyone "upgrading" to an Amazon and then looking after them really well, or are the engines going to last to 500k miles if well looked after, and most of us are unlikely to drive that far (in EU at least, maybe not in Oz / SA!)?

In short, I spent a lot of time getting the wife on board, would hate to have to change tack in 5 years when there are no more spares!!

Any thoughts appreciated, thanks guys.

 

[chapel gate]

Look after it and it will last as long as you want it too. I know of a cruiser that had over 400000 miles on the clock. Yes learn how to spanner, being self sufficient is allways a good thing.

 

[Towpack]

There will always be specialist help available for old LC's and many old vehicles for that matter but it will cost so learning to DIY and know your way round your vehicle is beneficial on several fronts.
Will new OE parts still be available in 20 years time? Some will, some won't but I can't forsee 'service' parts being an issue personally. You should be more worried about how much diesel will cost in 20 years time!
The 1h series of engines probably have one of the greatest longevity potentials of any mass produced engine made available to the general public, if their service schedule is followed religiously but neglect can kill anything. JMO

 

[Julian T]

In answer to your many questions, yes, personally I will not let a main dealer do any work on my vehicle, I have been driving my 80 for more than 10 years now and I believe that with regular servicing and repair when needed I will still be driving it in 40 years time if the government will let me.

If you want a good garage who knows your vehicle and will do a job with no problems down the road then you are going to have to to them, and they may in all likelihood not be local, in the UK I recommend Overland Cruisers and in Hungary I recommend Sandlander as I have used both, this forum is a treasure trove of information and enthusiasts of all things cruiser related and there are a lot more good garages around than the two I just named.

I believe two (I could be wrong) of the members on this forum have recently started a specialist workshop near Brackley (about an hour north of London) called Freedom 4x4

I think you will not go far wrong with picking the brains of any of the above, if they will let you

As regards the reliability a land cruiser is not a land rover, I too grew up in South Africa and spent a lot of time around series landies, mostly repairing them, and I never considered a land rover product when I was looking for a vehicle to take me out to the bundu and back because one of my uncles had a 40 series land cruiser and that thing never needed repairs or maintenance like the landies did.

Personally I never considered a 100 series, amazon, for two reasons, I don't like ecu's and sensors and I don't like independent front suspension on a 4x4 as for me there are too many moveing parts and they fail too easily on rough terrain, I had a Isuzu break its front suspension on corrugated roads in the cape far too often.
The 80 series is very truck like and with that toughness comes reliability, I have driven mine to Spain/Portugal for off roading as they call it in this neck of the woods, for me they all roads, just some of them were in poor condition, I have also driven the Pyrenees mountains from the Atlantic to the med and the prep for that trip consisted of a oil and filter service, and I did that in November.
I have done two trips to Hungary and one to Slovakia and on none of those trips was I ever concerned about whether I would have any problems and my truck is a rather abused one, previous owner did not look after her at all.

Hope this ramble helps.

 

[Shayne]

Try and find a modern vehicle that might survive 20 years as a daily driver . I bet you can't .

 

[clivehorridge]

I would suggest that wherever you go, you'll find mechanics that know this truck in all its variants and not only know it, but are enthusiastic devotees of the marque.

When I found a service center interested in maintaining my 80 for me, I was greeted by a small crowd of mechanics swarming around it in the car park. They were commenting on the mods that had been done on the truck, and were clearly pleased to have another 80 to go at.

She's got 378k on the clock and I've done 160k of those in 10 years. It's in better shape all round than when I bought it, and I can't think of many vehicles that would boast such a history.

I'd take it anywhere, tomorrow, with confidence.

quick edit:
Those are km not miles BTW

 

[Dave2000]

I do my own spanner work and I am a bit OTT when it comes to repairs, not only on my own cars but those of customers as well. I know the LR took more repair time than the LC does, even allowing for the competition work I used it for, it still took more 'fettling' than the LC ever has. I am not going to go into the LR versus LC debate I have owned and worked on both and will say the LC is better built period.

For this particular post forget the mechanical worries for the 80 long term, not only will they live longer than you could envisage but, there will be plenty of parts for many years to come, that is the nature of the beast when a vehicle becomes as popular as the 80.

Your parts supply in many years will be a mixture of OE and copies and herein lies the problem. There are copies that are not even close to the quality of the originals, they get fitted and two or three years (if your lucky) later there is a problem and the vehicles reputation gets some stick. I read a comment on here recently where someone said, they would rather fit a good second OE part than a copy, IMO I am inclined to agree. So, given the time scale you are talking about, I would keep an eye out for OE parts that you know will go wrong/need replacing. For example, you see an advert for an 80 water pump and it is OE and NOT 'OE quality', that term gets thrown around a bit too much for my liking. Check out the part numbers, and assuming they are on the pump, and of course the price is good then buy it. List that you have the part and pack it away somewhere dry and safe, if you are serious enough about this then you could spread the cost over a number of years and build your own parts backup. I used to do this for my old Jaguar but I eventually sold it as personal circumstances changed, and the chance of getting another was unlikely as it was rare. The LC 80 will always be around and if your circumstances change then you can sell the parts on. There are many parts that are different between the 12 valve and the 24 models so make your purchases with care.

Now to the real deal breaker......RUST! Mechanical parts have been covered but the chassis/body is the thing to carry them around. The LC is as prone to rust as the next vehicle, my own despite being cared for is going to need some welding in the rear of the sill on one side and perhaps on the other? So rust is where your enemy is at, your purchase may look the 'mutts nuts' on the outside and advertised as 'immaculate' (another word often used too much by sellers), but it is the parts you cannot see that matter. Get the car up on a ramp, get someone who knows the 80 to get under there with you, I am reckoning a genuine seller will not mind, especially if the car is good, and the price reflects it.

All beaten up with dents and rust under there then walk away, evidence of accident damage the same, do not rely on the companies you ring for accident data, if you find a car that is advertised as 'fastidiously maintained', and you arrive and point to the oil leak or mismatched tyres, and they are declared as 'just minor bits and pieces' then they too do not know what fastidious means. If your potential purchase needs nothing and everything works then then THAT is fastidiously maintained! Service history is a good selling point but, as already pointed out it is WHO done the servicing that counts. There are some beautiful examples out there, take a knowledgeable friend, take your time, not sure walk on, I looked at 4 or 5 before making my choice, I was lucky as I was about to fly back to Spain with no car, then one I missed came back up for sale and I got it.

Mine is over 21 years old now, and if I got a call tomorrow to do a 10,000 mile journey, I would fill the tank and go, such is the confidence these vehicles inspire when looked after.

Good luck with your future plans.

Regards

Dave

 

[Mblinko]

^ what he said, plus, do not phased by lack of history and don't buy from dealers most of whom don't give a stuff. Buy from an enthusiast or better still a club member, if you can find one willing to sell that is ..

 

[mettisse]

^ what he said, plus, do not phased by lack of history and don't buy from dealers most of whom don't give a stuff. Buy from an enthusiast or better still a club member, if you can find one willing to sell that is ..

Hi, good advice, I can tell you I've owned a Land Rover Disco 300 tdi from new in '95, had fantastic duty from it, my son now has possession and it is used in earnest on his small holding and as family transport for him/ wife and 4 of my grandchildren, been a good servant, Genuine ZF auto replacement box at 120k miles, second hand motor at 200kmiles ( £600 low mileage) now 300kmiles worth £0
Mirror my '94 Bruiser, owned 10 years, had rebuild on motor at 200 kmiles ( turbo grenaded) now 320kmiles worth £4,500?
verdict, both been to Morroco twice, both tow big trailers, both 7/8 seats, both been good servants, both with lockers, auto, so a good comparison I think, in retrospect, I should have bought the Cruiser in '95, it was £3000 dearer, I would have saved bundles in the long term. ( might add both are meticously maintained)
If you can find the " holy Grail" or a close second, it would be my choice of the Bruiser,
all the best in your search, don't give up, it does exist, hope you find it
best regards to all , Bill Westley