HJ60 Oil eating and leaking..

[Tom Miller]

Hi everyone,

I have run a search on the threads but didn't come up with anything so apologies if this question has been answered.

I have an HJ60 (1982) that was originally an AUS truck but now lives in the UK. I bought it from North Scotland with a recent re-spray and a dipped sub frame and new clutch. The 600 mile ride down to London was sweet! No problems sitting at 70 and chugging along,

I did notice quite a bad diesel smell but as I am new to the trucks, I didn't think much of it.

More recently the following has developed:
White smoke from the exhaust on start up (especially bad after a little rest of the engine e.g. 5 days)
Smell of diesel from the exhaust constantly emitted when running
Oil leak from what seems to be the rear of the engine at the centre 0f the vehicle

What this means is that I am eating oil, like almost a litre every 300 miles or so. I am currently topping it up with 15W 40

The engine is very smooth and pulls well, I don't have any issues with the drivability and we have done a bit of strenuous off roading without incident.

I am hoping the issues are related but I have a horrible feeling they are not.

Anyone with experience on this?

 

[StarCruiser]

Hi Tom and Welcome.

I’ve fortunately not had experience of this but would suggest you get a compression test done. Check your oil for signs of diesel in it and your radiator for signs of oil or combustion products.

Common causes are head gasket leak or more likely stuck or broken piston ring. Spray pattern and condition of injectors can also cause white smoke but not oil consumption.
How bad is the leak from the rear of the engine? Do you have any history on the vehicle? Which engine is it? Do you get any bluish smoke from the exhaust? Does it have a turbo?

There’s guys on here far more knowledgeable than I on these engines.

Good luck with it.

Rich

 

[Rodger]

Hi Tom and welcome,

I think that the two issues are not necessarily related:
Oil leak at the rear - the oil return way is at the rear of the head/block and if this oil way is partially blocked then the oil will escape via the rocker box gasket. It maybe worth removing the rocker box cover, cleaning and replacing the gasket. If you find a build up of old hardened oil, refit the gasket and rocker box and do an engine flush then change oil, filter, r/box gasket. I had this on my 2H when I first got it.

The smell of diesel suggests, as the truck is pulling okay, that either the fuel return pipe is partially blocked/ has a pin hole or that the injectors need servicing (although it probably wouldn't be running smoothly if that was so). Also change the fuel filter and bleed the system. Air filter clean?

White smoke on start up does suggest that the glowplugs aren't operating properly. Can you hear the relay click when in the start up sequence? If so it maybe the glowplugs themselves. (Make sure you get right plugs - Oz trucks are 12v - other countries tend to be 24v and the plugs are different).

2H engines are super reliable, even if they are old technology, so, although I agree with Rich and a compression test etc would be a good exercise, it sounds to me like a number of unconnected items need addressing.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Rodger

 

[StarCruiser]

I knew there would be someone with more knowledge on that specific engine and agree, look at the simple things first.

 

[AndycruiserguyLomas]

Hi everyone,

I have run a search on the threads but didn't come up with anything so apologies if this question has been answered.

I have an HJ60 (1982) that was originally an AUS truck but now lives in the UK. I bought it from North Scotland with a recent re-spray and a dipped sub frame and new clutch. The 600 mile ride down to London was sweet! No problems sitting at 70 and chugging along,

I did notice quite a bad diesel smell but as I am new to the trucks, I didn't think much of it.

More recently the following has developed:
White smoke from the exhaust on start up (especially bad after a little rest of the engine e.g. 5 days)
Smell of diesel from the exhaust constantly emitted when running
Oil leak from what seems to be the rear of the engine at the centre 0f the vehicle

What this means is that I am eating oil, like almost a litre every 300 miles or so. I am currently topping it up with 15W 40

The engine is very smooth and pulls well, I don't have any issues with the drivability and we have done a bit of strenuous off roading without incident.

I am hoping the issues are related but I have a horrible feeling they are not.

Anyone with experience on this?

Although I can only add to the thorough answer from Rodger I've just cured my 60 with some similar symptoms. Although there was a fair oil leak from the rocker gasket it wasn't using oil at that prodigios rate.
White smoke on start up is usually just one glow plug if it starts pretty well, I replaced all six of mine after the engine was rebuilt but ran white smoke for the first min as one was down. They don't start well, or at all if the glow plugs are poor.
The 2H engine will still run ok even when the injectors are way past their best but I'd have them out and tested. if they are well below spec they can be re tipped relatively inexpensively as a set of tips is below £100.
When you have the basics sorted and you know it runs ok if it still uses oil at the same rate I'd be inclined to have a look at the compression side of things in the engine. I've had lots of 60's over the last 20 years and none I've run have ever used any oil except the one I had the engine down as can be seen here.

https://www.landcruiserclub.net/community/threads/its-been-some-time.148762/

Keep us informed as to how you go on.

 

[Ben Stratford]

Potentially crankshaft rear oil seal may be leaking too. Is the engine covered in oil, a clean may help to reveal some evidence.
Another thing to check is the oil return pipe from the vacuum pump and the back of the alternator. If this has come adrift there could be losses.

 

[Tom Miller]

You guys are amazing! Thanks so much for the advice and first points of call. I took a few snaps under the engine to identify where the leak is stemming from but will get more thoroughly into it. Have been away for a while but drove on the weekend and the white smoke is now being emitted under load but il will follow the steps above and get diagnosing. Also uncovered a worrying mat of wiring in the engine bay but might ignore that until the engine is running smooth. P.s. If anyone wanted to recommend a mechanic close to Northants or London that will take on a 60 series, please do let me know!

Thanks again!
Tom

 

[moggy1968]

You guys are amazing! Thanks so much for the advice and first points of call. I took a few snaps under the engine to identify where the leak is stemming from but will get more thoroughly into it. Have been away for a while but drove on the weekend and the white smoke is now being emitted under load but il will follow the steps above and get diagnosing. Also uncovered a worrying mat of wiring in the engine bay but might ignore that until the engine is running smooth. P.s. If anyone wanted to recommend a mechanic close to Northants or London that will take on a 60 series, please do let me know!

Thanks again!
Tom

View attachment 147977 View attachment 147978 View attachment 147979 View attachment 147980

Not very near but Julian voelecker is your man for cruisers

 

[Rodger]

Hi Tom,

May I suggest that a engine wash with Gunk or Jizer and then a steam clean of the engine bay would help to narrow down the source. (cover the wings, alternator and screen in cling film and that will save a load of cleaning up later) and use a nylon brush (not wire) to shift the caked on stuff.
Obviously it needs a new sump bolt and washer as an animal has tried to eat it! But the oil flow to the rear indicates a top end leak as the oil appears to be adhering to the inner panels rather than coating the g/box and transfer/box.
Similarly the leak does not appear to be under pressure as so much is gathering around the sump.
The white smoke under load could be as simple as the water separator needs draining and the light is not connected (mass of wiring).

Regards,

Rodger

 

[Rodger]

Hi Tom,

I just started my truck after 3 weeks standing and no smoke. And a thought crossed my mind about your white smoke after starting and under load...
Check your glow plugs as the white smoke is unburnt fuel so it is firing by compression. Smoke when under load suggests that it is over-fuelling so it may well be worth getting the injector pump checked or as Andy said - get the injectors checked.
If there are no Toyota specialist mechanics near you a diesel specialist will be able to help.

Regards,

Rodger

 

[Tom Miller]

Hi guys,

So I finally got to do a bit of work on the truck on the weekend and found out the following:

Rodger I managed to check the glow plugs. One of the plugs was not working at all (passing no current) and so I have ordered a new one. My plug has 10.5v written on it and so I have ordered a
Denso Glow Plug DG-232 / DG232 Replaces 19850-68010 Y-147T

I must admit, I found the plugs choice to be quite confusing - I have 2 batteries so assumed it was a 24v system and read a guide somewhere that suggested this plug.

So my hope is, that the glow plug might sort my "White smoke on startup problem". I imagine it could also contribute to the smell of deisel in the exhaust as unburnt diesel is definitely being emitted from that cylinder.

Rodger, I did an oil change and looked for diesel in the old oil but didn't see anything out of the norm. However I did have a few unexpected turns with the Oil change. It went as follows:

1) I cleaned below the truck with Gunk as best I could and certainly across the areas I previously photographed as collecting oil.

IMG_0211

• Tom Miller
• Sep 5, 2018

IMG_0212

• Tom Miller
• Sep 5, 2018

I waited a while to see if the oil collected in those places but nothing immediate.

2) I took the opportunity to clean the engine up a bit with an engine flush - I used Wynn's and followed the instructions, heating up the engine and then adding the Wynns to the oil before leaving it to idle for 20 minutes.

3) I then left the car for about 30 minutes before starting to change the oil. I started by removing the plug from the sump. Then I let it drain. Shortly after that, I took of the oil filter and replaced it with a new one having put a little oil around the o ring.

4) After letting the engine drain for about 20 minutes, and making sure the small droplets of oil still coming out were very infrequent, I replaced the sump bolt with a new washer, and filled up the engine with 10.5L of oil.

This was me..

IMG_0243

• Tom Miller
• Sep 5, 2018

Once I had cleaned everything up, a few things struck me.

• There was nothing in the oil that looked funny, or any odd liquids resting on the surface, or any bits of metal etc that might be worrying.
• Only about 4L of oil came out of the engine.... and I put 10.5L back in....

So after a little while, I tried the dipstick (before starting the car and circulating the new oil) and It was way over the high mark! By a big margin!!

The dipstick had always read a bit funny, so I thought sod it, and took the truck round the block. The Oil immediately registered as very high on the dash reader, but then when the engine was hot, if I was at a standstill and engine at Idle - the oil level gauge would start to fall from full, and even got down to empty.

Can someone let me know when I should check the oil level (hot engine, cold engine, engine on..!??)
And also, is it terrible to run an engine with too much oil?

Anyway so that was a bit odd.

The second thing that was odd, was when I returned to the truck later, the oil leak when standing still had not come back where I thought it was, but looked to be coming from the transmission. Or around that area, still back further from the engine. I will add a few photos below.

So is there a separate transmission oil check I should be performing?

I still think I need to check a piston ring head to see if oil is being burnt in the engine. But that is a bit beyond me!

 

[Tom Miller]

This now looks to be the source of the oil dripping (which I am now assuming is very different to the oil being burnt when I drive along)

Just as a point of reference - I drove a few hundred miles the other weekend and I was putting in a litre of oil every 100 miles.. When I put the oil in, the dash measure would go up to 3/4 full, and then slowly over 100 miles drop down to zero. It is quite a burn rate! - But then I found I only emptied out 4L of oil when doing the oil change - so something must be wrong.

Screen Shot 2018-09-05 At 14.59.39

• Tom Miller
• Sep 5, 2018

 

[Tom Miller]

@AndycruiserguyLomas I think the injector test and compression test is next to help diagnose the oil being burnt - would this tell me if the piston rings etc are buggered like they were in your thread? Or be an indicator of that?

I have also rang a few garages who are not willing to do a compression test saying you need specialist equipment - Does anyone know if this is true? Can I just buy a compression tester myself to work out this next step?

 

[AndycruiserguyLomas]

@AndycruiserguyLomas I think the injector test and compression test is next to help diagnose the oil being burnt - would this tell me if the piston rings etc are buggered like they were in your thread? Or be an indicator of that?

I have also rang a few garages who are not willing to do a compression test saying you need specialist equipment - Does anyone know if this is true? Can I just buy a compression tester myself to work out this next step?

Yes they are right, you do need specialist equipment to test the compression on a diesel. The compression pressures are far higher than a petrol engine and you need an adapter to screw in the glowplug holes or the injector holes.
Just one thing, the "oil reader" as you put it is I guess the oil pressure gauge which does not read the oil level but the oil pressure generated internally within the engine to lubricate the moving parts. I would adjust the oil l;evel to be correct on the dipstick to start with.
It sounds to me like there may be 2 issues, the injectors and general wear in the engine. 2H engines will run and run even when they are very worn and the injectors are past their best. If rings are worn out the chances are that the pistons and bores will still be good enough to re ring. Valve guides are very durable but valve stem oil seals can go hard over time and not do the job they should.
This can lead to excessive oil consumption.

 

[Tom Miller]

Really interesting. So I have been reading it wrong the whole time! What is really confusing me is that, If I have been topping up the oil as a result of pressure dropping, rather than necessarily a leak? Why did only 4L of oil come out when I changed the oil!! The manual says it should take 10.5L So strange.

I will return the oil to its correct level - Find someone to do a compression and injector review - Inspect the leak from gearbox/transmission area and try and clean it up. The leak potentially started when I put it in low range and thundered up a particularly sharp hill at high revs.

I am also going to look into:
Faulty gauge
Faulty sender
Oil pump on its way out
Oil too thick/contaminated

From this thread: https://www.exploroz.com/forum/75166/trouble-with-oil-highlow-on-landcruiser

Thanks

 

[Nick Sabrazat]

...My plug has 10.5v written on it and so I have ordered a
Denso Glow Plug DG-232 / DG232 Replaces 19850-68010 Y-147T

I must admit, I found the plugs choice to be quite confusing - I have 2 batteries so assumed it was a 24v system and read a guide somewhere that suggested this plug....

Hi Tom,

I have had to go through a similar glow plug selection process a few month ago and I can tell you that 10.5V are not for a 24V system.
See thread below:

https://www.landcruiserclub.net/community/threads/glow-plug-selection-for-my-hj60.149746/

10.5V glow plugs may work for a while but will eventually fail on you, normally in the middle of the winter when you need them the most.

Nick.

 

[Tom Miller]

Hi Nick.

Sorry that was a mis-print, Actually believe I am on 12V system with a Fixed Delay. https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/which-plugs-should-i-be-running-b-2b-3b-h-and-2h-diesels.471567/

Given the old plug said 10.5v on it, I am confident the new one (which said the same) will work and it heated up nicely with a test on the battery.

Over the weekend, I settled the oil level and I replaced the faulty plug.

I am trying to get it to mechanic this week for Compression test and injector test. I will also ask them to diagnose the pressure dropping... Over to the pros!

 

[Rodger]

Hi Tom,
A little confusion here because you said it is an Oz import and later you state you have two batteries....
If you can post your full VIN number (plate on bulkhead under bonnet). It is the long number but all the others will help identify exactly what you have. Once we have your VIN we can trace it.

To clarify - most trucks in Oz are 12v but normally HJ60s are 24v. And the correct 24v (if it is so) glow plugs are very hard to get in Oz so it may have been fitted with the glow plugs that are for a 12v.

Hope that helps

Regards,

Rodger

 

[Tom Miller]

Hi Rodger,

As you are probably realising, I have a lot to learn. But I looked on the bulkhead and I have the following.

Frame number: HJ60 - 006540

There is also a model number. HJ60 RG-KO

IS that what you are referring to?

Thank you for your help

 

[Tom Miller]

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