Rust treatment and undersealing

Ratmos

New Member
I am in uk
Nov 9, 2019
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Does anyone have recommendations of companies in the south of England that will do a long lasting treatment. It has been done by a previous owner but obviously wasn't good quality because it just flakes off. Also I want a system that is resistant to jet washing after the car is exposed to gritted roads. At present I am considering a company in Uckfield, East Sussex. TIA
 

Shayne

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Feb 2, 2013
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South Wales UK
Doing it properly is very time consuming and theres no telling how much time was spent on the job when you pay someone to apply a thick black coat over the real work , so here's another vote for Krown which hides nothing instead its aimed at preventing rust from getting any worse .
 
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TONYCY11

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I am in cyprus
Oct 25, 2015
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That is why I would never pay any one to treat my car underbody for rust unless its just come out of the factory , , time is money and they will just skim over any rust with some anti rust treatment with out fully removing the rust and treating it (which is where 90% of the time is needed to be spent ) after the spay on anti rust spray they spray a coat of thick black paint or underseal and it will look great for a short time and they know it will help the rust get even deeper into the metal and by the time the owner finds out in 18 months or so time it will be too late to complain and the owner in many cases will then try to pass the car on to some unsuspecting buyer , the cost to do a proper job is around £100 and a full week of labour time if you do it yourself , all it takes is time and effort , after working on and treating mine and my kids cars for over 40 years you get to know how much treatment a rusting car needs in treatment for it to be successfully done ,
 
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Tractionman

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I am in england
Oct 11, 2013
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Agree Tony, I've done exactly the same. Awkward bits, ( and there are many) don't get skimped or missed, when doing it ourselves. We just push on and do a proper job regardless.
It's not all about spending money, paying someone else to do it, it's knowing it's done.
 

TONYCY11

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I am in cyprus
Oct 25, 2015
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Fully agree when its your own and you like the car and want to keep it for many years as well as keep its resale value , you go the extra mile , its the same with maintenance you do a much better job servicing your own car than a garage would , like using better oil and let the engine oil , transmission and diffs and transfer box drain for much longer to rid all the the old oil , and put oil in the oil filter before fitting so the engine is not starved of oil as much when starting up after the oil change , and greasing the props etc , or have someone do jobs like a egr clean or fit new injectors you only have their word that they did a proper job . as an example Toyota were doing injector seats replacements on 120s up to 2007 , most toyota dealers did not use new pipes or undid them at both ends , some just bent them back at the rocker box only for some poor owners for them to get contaminated the injectors with dirt or to leak at a later date , as well as the injector seats were replaced without cleaning the seating area for the seats properly and the new seats were then leaking blowby combustion way before they should and blocking the sump strainer risking complete engine failure , nor do they look up the engine drain sump when the do a oil change to check if the injector seats are leaking like a owner would . no I would never let a garage touch my car especially main dealers because their mechanics are rubbish and are mainly kids with only a few years in the job .
 
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TONYCY11

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I am in cyprus
Oct 25, 2015
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Thats right and a good mechanic works for himself in his own garage and not in a main dealer , which where the technicians are no better than the quick fit tyre etc technicians kids who work in those places .
 

Shayne

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Feb 2, 2013
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Thats the beauty of Krown its more like powerblast with a jestwash then spraying a thick wd40 over everything , i bought time to procrastinate over getting the wire brush out . I like that it gets places i never could with a brush as well .
 

qbartx

Active Member
I am in great_britain
Nov 21, 2018
59
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TONYCY11 let's start from the fact that for £100 you won't even buy the materials to do rust proofing properly. Also there is no chance that anyone will do a better job himself that someone that knows what he's doing and has proper tools. Unless you're going to buy £2k steam pressure washer just for that job? That and use of strong alkaline or caustic tfr to get rid of all old wax oil and other contaminations. Also that will be first and most important tool to remove a lot of old flaky rust. You want to do that hot as it will be dry much faster. Unless you're putting it in heated garage for a few days after pressure washing it?
Then depending on how bad is it in most cases you get de scaling gun out, that takes a lot of time too. Then you start sanding it down with various tools.
What you need to be left with is only thin surface rust.
Doing proper rust proofing is never about using one product. You need single pack self etching rust stabilizing primer like corolless/buzzweld re(that still corolless based) or similar and then top coat it with something durable like 2k epoxy. On that you can also spray wax as last coat. Obviously don't forget that most panels actually rust from inside out, most places tend to forget that. Pockets behind rear wheels, sills are especially known to rot on every 4x4. Popping out all factory rubber blanks and spraying stuff inside is a must. To do it properly you may need to drill some more holes and blank them off with rubber plugs after.
On most cruisers you can't call it proper rust proofing if you didn't take bumpers and wheel arch liners off. You would be surprised what you find on cars that cool solid.You either do that once and properly or you do a crap job and need to re do it every so often.
 

qbartx

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I am in great_britain
Nov 21, 2018
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Unfortunately there is as many bodgers in main dealers as in smaller garages. There is also people that take pride in their work but are not comfortable with running their own business and having much more work sacrificing private life. Not everyone needs to run their own workshop. Getting to the point of starting your own business is a long road and you need to have experience and know the market....even then many fail.
 
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Tractionman

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I am in england
Oct 11, 2013
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qbartx, from your long list it sounds as if you know what you are doing. Unfortunately, as we all know, and as you admit, there are many bodgers out there, main dealers or otherwise.
Because of the reputation of those that sully the rest, there is always doubt and suspicion, especially when this type of work (rust)is covered up, so the customer does not know for sure how good or thorough, the work is. It's not like you can see if new filters, an exhaust, ball joints, suspension, have been fitted, you get the point. Everything involving rust treatment is covered up as an end result,whether your way or somebody elses.
 

qbartx

Active Member
I am in great_britain
Nov 21, 2018
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Fortunately these days we're aided with smartphones so it's not hard to snap a photo and document progress of work. Actually you would be surprised how many jobs i actually book through facebook etc. Most stuff i do actually comes to me on trailers to bring it back to life especially 70 series and in some cases i don't even see the owner in person! You need to have some faith in people ;)
With rust proofing there is huge difference in pricing depending from the state of the car. It will be 10x more difficult to do proper job on a car that's been sprayed with oil few coats of schultz fillers and other crap than one that wasn't ever rustproofed before
 

TONYCY11

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I am in cyprus
Oct 25, 2015
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First of all I would NEVER buy a heavily rusty car , ONLY a idiot would in my mind, I spent around £100 pounds on paints and fluids ( 2 litres lidl version of hammerite anti rust paint german brand called beuwfix at around 7 euros a litre here in Cyprus ) and 2 litres of rust killing treatments (jeys ) around 40 UK pounds that I got when I was living in the UK and 5 litres of black waxoyl about 25 UK pounds from the UK before I came to Cyprus , used wire hand brush es of different sizes and wire drill brush wheel and wire angle grinder wheels and 5 full days doing the underbody and a little work in the engine bay for protection of my late 2009 120 which spent 6 years of its life in Birmingham by its first owner and 2 years in Huddersfield owned by me before I came to Cyprus , it was never used off road and only had light surface rust on the chassis and rear axle and tiny bits near the inner sills behind the font wheels , but I double treated any rust areas including double treating the chassis and crossmembers and bash plates after heavy wire brushing with power tools and hand wire brushes , I did all that in 40+ centigrade Cyprus heat and sunshine in just shorts and flipflops a bandana(to protect my hair ) and used goggles after bits were getting into my eyes with using the power tools , and with all the dirt and paint and black waxoyl I finished every day looking like a black man , but the job WAS done right and no need for me to drill into any panels because the was no rust that carried on to creep under any panels . the only things I had to take off were the bash plates and underbody spare wheel . no need to take bumpers off because they were no rust where the bumpers were fixed and the chassis rails near the bumpers were accessible . no rust behind the liners under front or rear wheel arches , the thing is its hard to buy rust treatments here in Cyprus because cars here just do not rust , my next door neighbour has a 1996 90 collie and does no body maintenance at all and the top body roof and bonnet has lost much of its lacquer but the under body is just like new no paint loss on the chassis , bashplates or axles at all .
 
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qbartx

Active Member
I am in great_britain
Nov 21, 2018
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You've just called idiots probably half of this forum lol As i said it's very easy to do that on something that has no rust on it but you forget about one thing. You say that there was no need to spray insides of panels etc. And that's exactly where you are most wrong. You are rust proofing it so making sure so it wouldn't rust more so if you've got no rust on it yet that's exactly the time to spray all the panels inside so next owner or you wouldn't have problems in X years time.
 

TONYCY11

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I am in cyprus
Oct 25, 2015
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I am in Cyprus it is not going to rust , cars here just do not rust , the only parts in panels that I sprayed in side with waxoyl was where the rubber grommets were that I removed before painting and I sprayed inside the holes before coating the grommets aswell before fitting them back . I see really old cars here including 1960s landcruisers with no rust just dull paintwork from the sun damage from not waxing , problems here are interior damage from the heat and the sun like cracked dashboards and rubber door seals etc perishing . when I took my 120 for its mot here the guys at the station told me there is no need to do such work under the car for protection because cars here do not rust ,
 
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Tractionman

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I am in england
Oct 11, 2013
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Yes qbartx, easy these days with smart phones to take pics of work and document, but with the unscrupulous, those pics could only show what they want, i.e. some good work, but not showing bodged or skimped work.
Why would anybody have faith in someone they don't know and never met, to send their vehicle to on a trailer.
Meeting someone in person, can give you a feel for what theyre like, how things might or might not progress.
In the case of rust treatment, it would be like giving that person a blank cheque, as you don't know what you are going to find when you get into it with your £2k steam pressure washer, i.e. welding, and the price keeps going up.
 

TONYCY11

Well-Known Member
I am in cyprus
Oct 25, 2015
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I seen plenty of old Landcruisers when i took a holiday in Cyprus and even the most neglected which the sun had bleached paint off looked great underneath , i guess they never get wet .
the body work of the cars here get that hot you can not leave your hands on them , I have a carport to park under thank god , it saves the interior from being in the sun and I still use vinyl protectant spray for the dashboard and always use a windsrceen sunshade when I park up outside and keep the bodywork well waxed .
 

qbartx

Active Member
I am in great_britain
Nov 21, 2018
59
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Unfortunately we do not all live in Cyprus and as you know cars here in uk do rust,a lot.
Tractionman, even if you would live local you won't stand over someone watching their hands or be checking in every couple hours so does it really matter that much? Don't think so. Maybe to me it's normal as i don't take the piss but i understand where you coming from.
Taking a car to a garage for anything it's like giving a blank cheque as you don't really have a choice how much you pay, you're not gonna say that you won't pay more in the middle of the job ;) You mention pressure washing...if it doesn't withstand pressure washing surely it was rotten. So do you want someone not too clean it too good so the price wouldn't go up? It's not really down to who or how is pressure washing it but to state of vehicle. That's why generally i don't give "quotes". To me it's absolutely pointless. I simply say that's my rate and it takes what it takes. I may give an indication how much i think it may be but that's it.
 
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