Life expectancy.

[Dave2000]

I must say as I get older I am becoming more and more cynical.

About 5 years back I recall someone quoting from a local Spanish paper that 'many 'EU' countries were saying they were not happy about the Spanish siesta, and planned to have it banned'.

Some conversation ensued and the general consensus from the Spanish around the table, was that the EU can go f*ck itself!

This morning I am watching Sky news, and there is a piece about how having a siesta can increase your chance of a heart attack. The immediate piece after was a report about Spanish pubs no longer banning pub crawls.

So the 'conditioning' that Spain/siesta/heart attack has begun or am I really that cynical?

Note, Spain has the highest life expectancy of any other country in Europe, with an average age of 83.

So, who is kidding who here?

regards

Dave

 

[frank rabbets]

Nobody knows Dave. It's just very marginal figures. Not like smoking which is very bad for you.

 

[clivehorridge]

A while back, we were sitting down to dinner as a family, together with my aging father-in-law.

Romanian cuisine is not particularly well known for excitement, but what he prefers to eat is beyond most modern comprehensions of good nosh.

He was eating blocks of pork fat, I mean solid fat traditionally cut into 1" sized cubes. Not even what I would consider the nice crunchy tasty stuff that's still not good for you but so nice you can't resist, but this was white, solid, fatty fat, ugh... He also layers salt on his food like it's going out of fashion, so much that the food turns white

And, he likes a tipple, which usually means a third of a pint of polenca, which averages around 80% proof...

So, I made the mistake of suggesting that he should take more care about what he eats and drinks. As soon as the words left my lips, I knew I'd said something unbelievably stupid.

He's 96 years old this year, he stands taller than me, he's not overweight in the slightest and he's strong. Although retired, he still 'works' researching and writing books on forestry and political memoirs (he was the minister for agriculture and forestry here between 1947 and 1968).

If we go for a walk in the country, he's eating all the time. Unbelievable. Flowers, leaves, dangerous looking fungi, berries, seed pods, even bark I've seen him chewing on . He knows his stuff, as a hunter (his hobby when younger) him and his cronies would spend a month living rough in the forest, hunter-gathering, and surviving very well.

He loves garlic (which I hate) and he'll sit watching tv with a dish of garlic cloves, popping them like peanuts!

It seems to me that the best diet is a varied one. In this modern age, we tend to refine everything, then consume it in vastly disproportionate quantities which can't be healthy. Sugar, pure sugar, and salt, by the kilo. The amount of sugar and salt in natural foods is sufficient in a balanced diet, yet one bar of chocolate, or jams and cakes, raises the sugar intake through the roof.

I'm no better than the average joe with my diet and living habits, and I smoke. So, according to statistics, I should be departing this mortal coil sometime in the next 5-10 years. We'll see.

But how is it that a siesta can "cause" heart attacks? Doesn't make much sense to me.

 

[lc 120]

Clive, your father in-law sounds like a star.....

 

[clivehorridge]

Clive, your father in-law sounds like a star.....

Oh yes, and that's an understatement!

 

[Rob Cowell]

I think the media very regularly either confuse or intentionally confuse causality and correlation. I haven't seen the siesta research, but typically this sort of thing is study a group of people. Note who takes siestas. Note when they die. Plot siesta taking against age. "Discover" siesta takers die earlier. This is a correlation. It doesn't mean siestas make you die earlier, it means the people who take siestas have something that makes them die earlier. Perhaps siesta takers also smoke more. Perhaps siesta takers tend to have manual jobs which wear out their bodies more. I'd be amazed if the report shows causality.

But also to agree with Clive. I think the most important thing you can do to ensure a long and healthy life is to make sure you are born to a family with a history of long and healthy people. Genetics are probably more important than anything. We have a photo of 5 generations of my family, all together and very much alive. My great grandmother smoked from a very young age, and died in her mid 90s. My grandmother is in her late 80s, healthy and active, and has smoked since she was 14. They have good genes. I think cutting out the cigs would likely let them live even longer.

 

[ByronJ]

I think the media very regularly either confuse or intentionally confuse causality and correlation.

Hmm. Like 'People who have lots of birthdays tend to live longer'?

 

[Dave2000]

Just to throw another spanner in the health works. As a kid I hated vegetables and fruit, my mother and father would not let me leave the table unless I 'ate my greens'. Of course I had better things to do, the Zephyr waiting for a set of six plugs for example (my first car at 10 years old), which is far more important than eating nasty smelly Brussel sprouts, so we had some handily placed plant pots and you just know where the greens were going right?

Over the years I have maintained the non consumption of greens/salads/most fruit ect. My diet is burgers, chips, Chinese, Indian, and kebabs, I do like to eat raw onions and often breakfast is in a local bar tomato on toast. I have never ever had a cholesterol problem although have had diabetes for 24 years now, (I weighed eight stone at the time), I smoked for around 20 years prior to the diabetes, but packed up on diagnosis.

A few months back I had run into problems maintaining a steady blood sugar, my levels were up and down like a pair of whores drawers!

After struggling for around a couple of weeks, the clinician sent me to the doc, he changed my insulin and recommended a different regime. This did not work after three days I was worse, so back to him again. So swapped back to the previous meds and he brought forward my normal 12 week blood test, and sure enough my levels were way off, and the test shows up a liver problem, it is releasing fatty deposits when it should not be, apparently a long term diabetes problem? So he prescribes me a pill which should sort the liver, he then comments about how good my diet and how good my cholesterol levels are but, he then apologises for prescribing another pill to control the cholesterol that taking the liver control tablet will cause!!

So,

regards

Dave

 

[moggy1968]

With regards to Clives Grandfather, the key thing you note there, obliquely, is that he eats a lot of natural shit, and that's one of the keys to a long life. Heart disease, obesity, diabetes are all very strongly related to all the processed shite we stuff into our bodies. Even cancer. Traditionally it was assumed cancer wasn't seen in older civilizations just because they didn't recognise it so it wasn't diagnosed, however, recent investigations on Egyptian mummies, which are well enough preserved to be able to be autopsied, have shown that cancer is virtually non existent, even in the oldest members of their society. It's growth is entirely related to modern living and the shit we eat and live in.

I have also seen and heard of lots of studies showing that the siesta is in fact good both for productivity and for a longer life. As above though, other factors have to be considered in life expectancy, such as the Mediterranean diet (see about natural shit above!)

To develop the theme of newspapers publishing shite above, one of the things newspapers are very prone to doing, especially if it generates a nice bit of hysteria, is taking one piece of research, frequently of small scale, and then quoting it as the new gospel, even if it goes against dozens of good studies before it. They are also very prone to taking data out of context or failing to analyse it correctly. remember, by and large journalists aren't scientists and know shag all about what constitutes good research, how to critique research and how to interpret the results.

Occasionally there are good articles published in the papers, but you really have to dig in to the subject and check their source material to establish if it is good or not.

to take another theme from above, genetics is absolutely key. You can load the odds in your favour by making good lifestyle choices (like I don't !!) but genetics is key.

 

[Dave2000]

Good post, moggy.

Has to be said that I am living proof about Cholesterol, I don't have any !! My diet is crap, I cannot cook to save my life, so it is all the easy grub for me. It is often easier to just stop in a fast food outlet and grab something on the way home.

Good point about genetics, my nan had diabetes from a young age, my mother, along with her sister and brother did not get it. It skipped a generation and got me. one of my four sisters has it as well.

regards

Dave

 

[Shayne]

If you can find it i watched a documentary once about Robert Baden-Powell and was left to wonder if he personally did more to take Britain out of the dark ages from a life expectancy point of view than any Government before or since .

 

[Towpack]

"If your numbers on it" as the saying goes. There's another thread running on here somewhere "One Life, Live it". I think that says it all. If you want a fag, have one. If you want a few beers have them. If you want to live and eat your way through life purely organically that's fine but don't get hung up on it. Some people expose themselves to life threatening danger everyday and think nothing of it while others fear crossing a busy road. At the NW200 races in NI last Saturday a young lad, 20 yrs old, made his debut at the track . He came with an impressive record and obviously naturally talented he was running with the top guys from the start. On the 3rd lap of his second race he lost his life in an incident in Portrush forcing the abandonment of the meeting. It's always sad when such things happen, especially being so young but he certainly was "Living the Life". Even his family new and accepted that.

 

[Pat]

I just turned 79 and have had medical insurance at a high cost for50 years.I look at my body like a truck.It doesn't go that fast but make sure you give it regular repairs and maintenance.ihad steel work in my back 2 new knees,2 new hips,stent in the ticker,got 2 fractures in the upper spine,had cataracts done in eyes,got 20/20 vision now got arthuritus but gonna fix it .take about 18 pills a day half to fix you the other to settle your guts but I thank the lord that I felled about 8 decent sized trees today with my Stihl023 and shifted them down
n a track and then pushed them in a stack with my traxcavator.If I stopped working a bloke would not last.My mates and I take an interest in politics and have some spirited discussions.Still admire women,not a great achiever
though.Love animals and reckon you've got to have a few laughs a day to
make life good.
Clives father in law is one it out of the box and may he still go on.Pat

 

[Shayne]

This and Ben's comments on his own thread about sugar intake made me wonder about the blokes in my very large extended family most of whom live on chips (the British kind) and gallons of tea with 3 heaped spoons of sugar in each cup , yet while considering maybe 40 lads aging from 15 to about 65 i can't think of one with any medical issues (not relating to injury) and at 6ft and 15 stone i can think of only 3 that might weigh more if only because they are considerably taller than me .

Its easy to say its all in the genes but i have to wonder if attitude towards food plays a part in it .

I'm not sure how or why it came about but there seems to be no meal times among us , the prevalent attitude seems to be food is fuel so eat when you need some which often pans out with "oh well i will eat something tomorrow instead" and that brings to mind an interesting documentary about what hunger does to our bodies .

Eat fast and live longer with Dr Michael Mosley

 

[Pat]

in my working life,started early 4-5 am then stopped about 9-30 had a decent feed then maybe a cups about 1 and then work till finished which was any time,then back to camp and tea and hope the cook wasn't an alky,because we had a few bad ones .Most of the blokes have lived to good ages.

 

[Shayne]

There's hope for me yet then Pat because my first job paying tax and insurance was a 5-6 am start then chipshop for dinner at 12 and if we were lucky enough to finish before the pub shut a few pints before bed .

I wasn't old enough to pay tax and insurance on my wages but when i ask the buggers just make a song and dance about how and why i have two national insurance numbers both with credits on . Makes me laugh its their mistake and its still on record if i live to 80 i might sue them for a refund plus interest

 

[Pat]

There's hope for me yet then Pat because my first job paying tax and insurance was a 5-6 am start then chipshop for dinner at 12 and if we were lucky enough to finish before the pub shut a few pints before bed .

I wasn't old enough to pay tax and insurance on my wages but when i ask the buggers just make a song and dance about how and why i have two national insurance numbers both with credits on . Makes me laugh its their mistake and its still on record if i live to 80 i might sue them for a refund plus interest

When I was about 20 after working for my father for sweet fanny Adams and a lot of promises Igot a job in a top contracting firm as a driver,Jack of all sorts and I did this for the next 7 years.It was the making of me as you worked and camped with a good bunch of blokes mostly 2nd war men as bosses and good hard men.You had to behave but we had a lot of fun.In the road sealing season started about 4-5 and through to 7-8 and then down the country there used to be kitchen evenings in a local hall which was old time dancing and supper.Pay
half a crown at the door or bring a gift which went to the bride to be.We had great times got stuff all sleep and fell in love with heaps of girls.I did this until
I went contracting for myself when I got married and the long working hours didn't cease.I wouldn't change a bit of it because it is up to ourselves to make good.I visited one of my Dalmatian cousins one day was asked what my wife was like.Very good I said.then Is she a good worker?Oh yes.The reply was looks soon go but the work goes on and I must say that my wife is a champion worker.One day a council engineer came to see me but I wasn't home.When he
saw me later he told me my wife was out on the quad bike shifting cattle and then she stopped by the woodpile picked up the chainsaw and cut the nights firewood.He was amazed.I said did she have her helmet and safety goggles and
chainsawing chaps on.I kept a straight face and said by God I'll give her a bollocking when I get home.It's something we have taken for granted and we
did buy her a nice new oleo-Mac chainsaw for her birthday.
Aint life grand.

 

[Pat]

Just some photos of gear we worked with and a bit of the countryside.Pat

 

[clivehorridge]

Love the old photos Pat, a bit of nostalgia to see the RB rope operated face shovel and the box scraper. What make is that? It doesn't look like a Cat or Terex...

Shayne, I recon you're due to receive 2 pensions from the state!

On the subject of food intake, IMO, if you're active, sugar gets burned off. On injestion, sugar transforms to glucose and it's pure energy. Burn it and you're OK.

For 20 years plus, I had 1 meal a day at about 8:00 pm. Doctors will say that's not good, but it never seemed to do me any harm, I have no stomach ulcers or anything remotely connected to that lifestyle. Of course I drank tea and coffee with sugar in it, so from waking in the morning till food in the evening I was managing on the sugars in the drinks, but I never felt any ill-effects.

Now, I still can't stomach breakfast (except at weekends at about 10:00 am) but my main meal is at lunchtime, with a snack type meal at 7-8:00 pm when I get home. These days I'm hungry at 12:30, so a lunchtime meal is ideal.

Eat when you're hungry, I say, not to any set time.

 

[tonytoyota]

Hi thanks for the pics love the old trucks from Tony.