Starting Sill replacement - anyone got pics of sills removed

[MisterCruiser]

With the help of a good welder friend I'll be starting to repair the sills on my SWB 120. I'll be doing the passenger side first as that's the worst. The sill with the side step brackets is very bad, I believe that's the inner most sill.

I think theres 3 layers of sill, inner /outer and a middle one of some form too. I plan to buy aftermarket sills of 1.2mm thick, I think the standard Toyota ones are 1mm but not 100% on that. I'm buying the complete sill lengths where I think you cut them to suit but I'm planning on replacing the entire lengths I think.

I'll post pics here along the way, but just wondering if anyone happens to have a few pics or a link to pics with the inner sill removed, or any of the sills removed just so I can see for reference what it looks like and where the joins or cuts were made.

I seen Bob Murphy's thread on his sill replacement and pics but I believe that is based on a 200 series which may be different. Would be good just to have something to reference before I start.
There doesn't seem to be any youtube videos of this but if someone knows of one feel free to link.

 

[stumog]

You would be just aswell searching for a generic process to replace sills as most of this is done as you cut. Each one will be different due to how bad the rust is.

 

[Tractionman]

As you are doing complete lengths, won't the existing sill joints inner and outer, give you a reference ? I appreciate it won't tell you before cutting at least one off, whats inside and how its configured.
Time consuming, but in the absence of any pics, maybe a piece at a time to see ?
The good part is, once you have done one side, you will know exactly how to attack the other.

 

[MisterCruiser]

Nice weather this evening so I made a start on the passenger side just lying under it. Removed the passenger side step, brackets, mud flap and the plastic trim length. I'll have to buy 3 new step brackets but already knew that.

It's maybe not as bad as I thought, the inner is goosed alright but the outer isn't too bad, in my opinion, I'll wait to be told otherwise by more experienced sill replacers, haha .
The outer is still sturdy, no holes, but gets a bit ugly and bubbly looking towards the rear of it alright as seen in pics.
Also, when I look through the holes in the inner I can see the inside of the outer has some rust on it.

So a few questions:
1 - I don't see the 3rd sill though? I thought there is 3 layers or sill lengths on the 120?

2 - Also, the red piece circled, this is at the front of the cruiser, is this piece part of the floor or part of the sill? Will this come with the new sill basically?

3 - Will new aftermarket sills come with the holes for clips etc pre-drilled already in them

4 - Going by the pics, would you be inclined to go ahead and replace both the inner and outer sills or just the inner one? Or just replace the inner and replace only the rear most section of the outer?

5 - Would anyone have a pic of a brand new inner sill?

 

[stumog]

If it were me I'd try cleaning up with a grinder wire a wire brush and see where you find shinny metal first. That outer looks like it may clean up and id just make patches on the inner. As I reckon most of that would clean up

 

[MisterCruiser]

It'll be hard to patch the inners though as the bolt holes for the side brackets are part of the rotten area's and how will I make a patch with proper captive bolt nuts etc,,, Will an aftermarket sill come with the captive nuts fixed to them? I may fone them and ask.

Here's the sills I had planned to buy, they're 1.2mm thick

North South 4x4 Spares - NS4x4

Based in County Monaghan, Ireland, specialists in Toyota parts for over 15 years

www.ns4x4.ie

 

[AndycruiserguyLomas]

and how will I make a patch with proper captive bolt nuts etc,,

Rivnuts??

 

[MisterCruiser]

Rivnuts??

The hassle of that, better off getting genuine sills then where everything lines up and captive nuts in place.

 

[stumog]

I wouldn't be sure the captive nuts does come with those sills you linked to be honest. Most panels require some level of fabrication before fitting they aren't like a bolt on wing. Even they need holes drilling etc

 

[MisterCruiser]

The aftermarket sills I linked don't come with the captive nuts for the side step brackets, he said you put the brackets on the side step and then line the step and brackets up to the sill and mark a spot to rivet them or nut sert them I guess. He also said even the genuine sills don't come with the captive nuts but surely they do as they're on they're attached to the inner sill aren't they, least on mine they are?

For a 2004 120series LC3. Are all 2003-2010 Lc3's Prado's? Is there a non-Prado of the 2003-2010 120 model? Gets bit confusing when looking for parts and keep seeing Prado option.
Can anyone confirm the below part numbers are correct for the inner sills:
61462-60020 inner Passenger side, LH

61452-60020 inner drivers side, RH

Do these genuine Toyota ones come with a little section of the pillar uprights on them as well? If so, then this could be a lot of extra work, I'd be gaining on the one hand by having I assume the side step bracket captive nuts included but losing on the other hand by having to remove my complete inner sill and it's attached pillar sections? Is my understanding of this correct?

 

[karl2000]

Youre right it is confusing but I think all 120s are Prados and all LC3's are Prado's!

 

[Rob Cowell]

Prado is just what Toyota calls the baby Land Cruiser in some markets. So that's your 120. But also the 150, 90, and the light duty 70s. A 2003-09 Prado will be a 120. The 1996-03 Prado is what you would have had in Ireland (and we had in the UK) as the Colorado.

The part numbers you are refering to are the sill reinforcement panels. I haven't repaired 120 sills, but I have done sills on other cars. Looking at the parts diagrams I *think* the following holds for the 120.

There are 3 parts to the sill construction. An outer sill, which is the bit with paint on it you revealed when you removed the plastic trim. This is part of the full side panel of the car, the bit the doors bolt to further up.

Then there is a floor side member, its a channel that welds to the floor panel and to the outer sill. It's the bit your running board bolts to and the bit that generally you see rusting apart. On a 125 (short wheel base) that should be part 57402-60900 or 57401-60900 depending on the side.

And inside the floor side member and outer sill is the reinforcement panel you are refering to. That might be rusty too. But you won't know until you have cut out your inner sill. The bad news is if it is rusty you'll probably need to cut away the outer sill to repair it.

 

[Juddian]

While doing the job, i wouldn't bother with new step brackets, always thought bolting steps to the bodyshell was a daft idea anyway.
Instead maybe fashion some brackets up that use the strength of the chassis, similar to how rock sliders are attached but needn't be quite so heavy duty.

 

[Tractionman]

I didnt bother with original sidesteps and brackets when both my inner/outer sills were done, for that very reason Juddian.
I bought some new s/s sidesteps (tube variety) very cheaply, intending to do just what you suggested, unfortunately, after fitting just one of 3mm mild steel brackets fettled, to chassis, it was apparent because of the distance step was away but tight- ish to outer sill, there would be too much leverage, when stood on + the whole shebang either side would add lots of weight.
At that stage, the project was put on hold until another plan formed, which on the face of it looks like extra support hangers to brackets from floor, nearer steps. More weight.
I feel the floor would have to have further reinforcing.
I quite like the look of no steps, but the Mrs is not happy getting in and out.

 

[MisterCruiser]

So here is pics of the passenger side inner sill pretty much removed, access to it's sides towards the rear with grinder disc, drills, etc. is extremely tough. The majority of it was rotten, looked ok in places but when scraped back it was obvious. Some of the intermediate or middle layer is rotten and removed too.

We're going to weld in a rectangular channel box section 60mm wide x 40mm high x 3mm thick the entire length of the sill and the weld the new sill panel to that length, half way up it, and weld the other end of the sill to the floor. Ill post a prototype pic of this plan later.

Also, can anyone tell me what that panel bonding adhesive stuff on the original Toyota floor panels is? Can it be got from Toyota or can someone recommend a similar product that I can buy?

 

[Tractionman]

Don't know what Toyota use, but Tigerseal or MHP are good ones.

 

[MisterCruiser]

Don't know what Toyota use, but Tigerseal or MHP are good ones.

Thanks, I'll have a look for them, hopefully can find them locally.


Here's a few more pics of my piece of rectangular channel box temporarily in place just to show the idea of it, the sill will be welded to the side of it and then to the floor.

The sill panel I bought isn't a great fit, the angles of it's bend profiles are wrong. I'm thinking when that channel box is welded in place, we'll make a carboard template shape of the exact sill we need and get an engineering place to bend a length of sheet metal into a matching shape of the template, for us. Am I correct in assuming this should be easy enough to get a place to make for us?

 

[Tractionman]

A sheet metal works or fabricators are the people to ask for that.
Not sure if you're talking about the inner or outer cills, but aftermarket panels are always a bit hit and miss, as you found out.
Martin my body shop/classic restorer used genuine outer and fabricated the inners to suit.
The box section you are using, although heavy, will give you much more strength 're the side step brackets when it comes to replace.

 

[stumog]

Could even chop the sills off completely and fit a piece of box section in there place. Been done a few times on discoveries. No need then for separate sliders

 

[MisterCruiser]

Could even chop the sills off completely and fit a piece of box section in there place. Been done a few times on discoveries. No need then for separate sliders

Yeah, I heard mention of that here before, some lad just welded box section on and no sills but I think he was using it for proper off-road on rocks and such.
Did you mean to type "sills" instead of "sliders", and if not, what do you mean by sliders?