SUBFRAME REPLACEMENT?

[Cantoyota66]

Hi Guys, Got a v6 petrol LC5, it’s failed the MOT due to significant corrosion on the front subframe. Was wondering what a job like that involves and the costs and if it involved dropping the engine at all? Detailed MOT failure below Refusal Notices • Front subframe mounting prescribed area fractured significantly reducing structural strength (5.3.6 (a) (i)) - Major Advisory Notices • Front suspension arm corroded but not seriously weakened o/s/f n/s/f (5.3.3 (b) (i)) • Front suspension arm pin or bush worn but not resulting in excessive movement o/s/f n/s/f (5.3.4 (a) ()) • Integral body structure is corroded but structural rigidity is not significantly reduced front to rear both sides (6.1.1 (C) (1)) • Rear rear axle corroded

 

[Rob Cowell]

The chassis (because there isn't a subframe on a 120 - although there is a bolt in cross member to hold the gearbox in) is cracked somewhere near the front of the car where something mounts to it. So that could be the engine, or the body, or the front wishbones, or the front anti rollbar linkages. None of those should need the engine removing, although you might need to jack and support it to replace an engine mount turret. Do you know what is mounted to the chassis where it has fractured? Even better have you got a picture?

 

[Cantoyota66]

Hi Rob, cheers for the reply. I’m not really familiar with the mechanics of these 4x4s, it’s my first time buying one, so thanks for the reply before I go ahead and actually buy it. I’m assuming the reason it doesn’t have a subframe is because it’s similar to a Range Rover in the way that the car has a frame which the engine and all components sit on which can be separated from the body ?

Anyways, after checking the MOT history properly, it appears the most recent MOT shows that it passed through an appeal. I asked the seller and he says that when he got it MOT’d they had a big disagreement, the MOT tester claimed it was the ‘subframe’ that was all rusty and seller said it was just the undertray cover. They resolved this dispute by appealing the MOT test through DVSA and the DVSA rep (who’s been an MOT tester for 20 years) said the seller was right and so it passed and the new mot test only has some advisories which I’ve put below. I’ve check the sellers claims out and can see in the MOT history it says :


This is the result of a retest carried out by DVSA due to a statutory appeal.

Monitor and repair if necessary (advisories):

• Nearside Front Suspension arm corroded but not seriously weakened (5.3.3 (b) (i))
• Offside Front Suspension arm corroded but not seriously weakened (5.3.3 (b) (i))
• Nearside Front Suspension arm pin or bush worn but not resulting in excessive movement (5.3.4 (a) (i))
• Offside Front Suspension arm pin or bush worn but not resulting in excessive movement (5.3.4 (a) (i))
• Rear Axle Corroded

So I’m just awaiting pictures from the seller now to see how bad the rust is, he said it’s just surface rust and he’s never seen a 120 Landcruiser that isn’t rusty. This is one of the better ones he’s seen.

Im quite surprised I’ve managed to find a V6 petrol version As most of the ones I’ve seen is diesel.

Do you know what the common things to look out for on the V6 model are? , the mileage is 120k. I know the diesel ones can do 200k + if well maintained. Not sure about these though. What should I be looking for.

Thanks a bunch

 

[Tractionman]

Well, well, an mot tester who's opinion was wrong/didnt matter - there's a big difference in subframe (obviously wrong) and an undertray. I wonder if he still has his ticket ?

No corrosion mentioned at all underneath apart from advisory items.

All items that will require attention sometime soon, but you now have a heads up on the situation.
The pics from seller will help identify a good indication, although its much better to evaluate in person, probably not too bad considering DVSA were involved and over ruled the tester.
The seller is not far wrong when he says he has never seen a non rusty 120 (I wonder how many he's seen though)? Mostly the better ones have been well looked after, (not just shiny paintwork) or are imports.
If you go ahead, get on the underside with proper prep and protection asap, so this winter won't make things worse. Probably impossible now unless you have a workshop/barn/large covered area to work.
Sorry, can't comment on the v6 engine.
Good luck !

 

[Juddian]

You can't go by pics, to judge how good or bad the rust is you have to get underneath yourself or get someone you trust who does know these things to check it out for you, usually the arse end sffers more, rusty rear axles are standard for these, just depends how bad it is.

The MOT advisories don't actually mention the chassis itself, the 120 sump guard undertray was made of cheese and many of us have replaced ours with aftermarket offerings.

If it is solid underneath and all checks out buy it, keep in mind general running about don't expect much better than 20mpg from the petrol lump, my Collie with the 3.4V6 (a truly superb engine) typically returned 18 or so.

You'd think an MOT tester would know the difference between a subframe and ladder chassis.

 

[Rob Cowell]

Those advisories are just either the top or bottom wishbones are a bit old on both sides. Old, but right now nothing wrong with them. Top one takes less than an hour to change and costs under £100. Bottom ones are closer to £200, plus budget for new mounting bolts because the old ones seize. Take less than 2 hours to change if you commit to just cutting the old bolts off with a reciprocating saw.

If I had 10 minutes to check a 120, I'd spend 9.5 minutes poking round the back of the chassis, especially the cross members. Where the suspension arms bolt on to the chassis. And the turrets on the axle.