Benefits and Concerns with a 120

[BIG clean GREEN]

Howdy folks...

I'm thinking of upgrading to a 120, LC3 or LC4 for towing my twin axle van down to the south of France next year, my current LC only gets 14mpg when towing, so need something more economical.

I sat with Chris the other night talking through lots of vehicle options, I was quite keen on the Amazon 100, however I'm not really any better off with fuel so that kinda defeats the object.

Next was the 120, from my understanding from Chris the LC5 is the muts nuts with all the gadgets include a possible troublesome air suspension on the earlier models, for this reason I'm thinking maybe the LC4, the last thing I need is to be in trouble in the middle of France with 2 kids a nagging wife and poorly car

I don't want to spend any more than 10k including whatever I get for my motor.
I like the gadgets, especially a built in sat nav.
I'm thinking I want manual for towing, however I'm not sure if this makes as much difference wth the D4D engine and 5 spd box as it does with the 90s
I'm not in any rush as I wont be going to EU untill next year, also I'm gagging for the snow to come so I can try out my BFG mud tyres !
So what do you guys think who own them ? please let me know all the pro's and con's and which one you'd advise

Cheers,

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

Can't help you with knowledge of 120's but any truck you lift and fit bigger / heavier / knobbier tyres to will suffer reduced performance so looking at consumption for a standard vehicle isn't worth much. 14mpg is pretty low though so maybe something needs fixing on yours.

 

[BIG clean GREEN]

It only does 23mpg with no van on the back which I beleive to be the norm for the non D4D 90s, I guess it would be much better with a 5 speed auto, the problem I find with mine is that unless I can keep it above 56mph but no higher than 60mph it keeps changing gear and increasing the rpm, I used the o/d more this year but to no avail with regards to mpg !

 

[Steve]

Hi I tow with a LC4 auto twin axle van weighing 1800kg and return around 20 mpg towing and 31 average solo.

I had a manual 120 before my current one and it was hard work towing with the 6 speed box the auto is spot on.

It will sit at 70 all day with the van on the back

 

[Crispin]

If you do want a manual, get the 6 speed (or at least look into it more). I have the 5 speed and at 70/80 the engine is spinning a bit. The auto is a much more relaxed drive.

As for fuel consumption, my best ever was 550 miles to a 80L tank (bone dry at the end) which is about 31mpg. That was nothing but stop start crawl commute for a week.
When it was standard, I was getting around 29-30mpg if I kept it below 80 on the hiway.

With all the mods I have now, I don't think it is that bad. Bigger tyres, heavy bash plates, taller shocks and now the extra weight of the bumper and winch, I have just finished my first tank (put in 76L) and got 457 miles out of it. That is just over 27mpg.

By far the biggest difference was keeping the tyres at 42psi instead of the 35 they used to be at.

I would look at the auto though, the manual is hard work with traffic driving and does get boring.

 

[lc 120]

I tow a 2 x tonne twin axle with an LC3 and have just returned from a 2200 mile trip around France, I averaged 22 mpg with my auto box a roof box and 5 people in the LC. Plus on the return journey we carried enough wine to add another 1/2 tonne...

 

[Nuclear Chicken]

Don't rule out the LC5. There may be stories of suspension woes but they are few and far between. The rear is self levelling which is very useful when towing and the comfort settings are useful on a motorway run. The LC5 also has the better DVD based touch screen sat nav system which is PDG. My LC5 was used and abused prior to my getting it and I had no issues of note with anything. A well looked after motor will almost certainly be fine. And the stereo system in the 5 is pretty much the dog's.

That aside, it's largely down to luxuries and some differences in the ways the rear and/or front diffs lock and the fact the 5 has air springs on rear vs coils.

Go auto all the way. They're excellent in every way, give better MPG (better gearing) and on later ones (around late '05 onwards) the auto was 5 speed which improved consumption and had torque converter lockup.

 

[Graham]

Don't rule out the LC5. There may be stories of suspension woes but they are few and far between. The rear is self levelling which is very useful when towing and the comfort settings are useful on a motorway run. The LC5 also has the better DVD based touch screen sat nav system which is PDG. My LC5 was used and abused prior to my getting it and I had no issues of note with anything. A well looked after motor will almost certainly be fine. And the stereo system in the 5 is pretty much the dog's.

That aside, it's largely down to luxuries and some differences in the ways the rear and/or front diffs lock and the fact the 5 has air springs on rear vs coils.

Go auto all the way. They're excellent in every way, give better MPG (better gearing) and on later ones (around late '05 onwards) the auto was 5 speed which improved consumption and had torque converter lockup.

.
Hi NC,

Surley you mean the center diff lock.
To have a front locking diff on the 120 is an aftermarket jobbie, and then I believe it's a messy affair.

G.

 

[Nuclear Chicken]

Yes Graham, you're possibly right. Just highlighting the 'differences' in the 3, 4 and 5 models. I know there are rear and centre locking differences and, without getting into the specifics, I wasn't too sure about the front locking options TBH. It was more to make a point in principle I suppose.

 

[Chris]

I liked my LC3. It was a no nonsense jobbie. Can't remember if it had cruise. Gotta love that cruise.

The posh ones get traction control which in effect does give it the edge over a mechanical RDL and CDL I suppose. But then tyre choice is crucial too if you expect to go anywhere.

Eh, Crispin.


Chris

 

[Graham]

I liked my LC3. It was a no nonsense jobbie. Can't remember if it had cruise. Gotta love that cruise.

The posh ones get traction control which in effect does give it the edge over a mechanical RDL and CDL I suppose. But then tyre choice is crucial too if you expect to go anywhere.

Eh, Crispin.


Chris

.
Hi Chris,
AFAIK they all have cruise,
Minimum speed 27mph.
TBH, the LC3 is the no-nonsence one, as you say.
Sure, heated leather may appeal to some, hight control may also appeal to some, even the built in nav, must have some benefit, not sure I would use it inplace of the very good Tomtom's that really are the dogs.
I remain to be convinced of the LC5 electronic traction control, to be any better, or vastly better than a mechanically locked rear and center diff.
I remember posts, that said that by the time the electronic traction control had worked out, it was in a slipping situation, then the situation quickly became worse.
As opposed to setting the LC3 rear and center diff's locked, BEFORE getting into any messy
situation, gave better prospect of extraction.
However as you mention, nothing is any good, unless the tyres are suited for the terrain.

G.

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

Traction control is pretty handy on-road for snow / ice and you can always retro fit diff locks

 

[Gary Stockton]

Got to say that so far I've only been in a position once where a rear diff lock may have helped, otherwise locked centre diff and ATRAC II has been fine. I've been more impressed with the sat nav the more I understand what it can do, and the self-levelling rear suspension is brilliant - loaded to the brim and we're still level with no issues. Premium sound system is very good, as is the Optitron instrumentation. Yes, there've been one or two auto-height issues - I've had one and I'm aware of only one other one.

Try get a 2005 or pref 2006 model - injector issues sorted, and you get rear parking sensors

17" rims are a pain - tyres are way more expensive than 16" rims.

The rear load space is weirdly shaped, and the rear tailgate slopes inwards at a stupid angle. The 100 series is much more regular in shape. And I'm not sure that a 100 series TD is just as economical towing a biggish van as the 120, possibly better off as the torque values are better IIRC.

Horses for courses. I'd probably look for a 100 - but then I'm nuts anyway

 

[Graham]

Hi Gary,
Not completly nuts,
If I was going to change any time soon, then it would be a 100 VX diesel for me also.
I would like the "wiggle gate" gear selector, as I believe they have the later autobox.
2005 onwards I believe ,

G.

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

I don't think traction control was ever available on the diesel 100's and 5 speed was mid 2003 onward I think.

 

[Gary Stockton]

The 2004 100 series comes with ATRAC and VSC across the range:

http://www.toyota.co.uk/vs2/oldpdf/04/LV3_95_over.pdf

Seems that was the facelift year when the DVD based SatNav came in as well. PDF for 2003 and prior not available ...

Sorry for the slight hijack

 

[Graham]

I don't think traction control was ever available on the diesel 100's and 5 speed was mid 2003 onward I think.

.
Hi Jon,
Was it middle of 2003 that the 100 's got the wiggle box, which denoted 5 speed.
Sorry, I should never have started the variation on the original topic,,,,,
What year was the troublesome fibre washer improved upon then?

G.

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

I think q3 they start selling the next year model so the 1st 2004 model year actually get sold from q3 2003 The TC washer problem was till about mid 2001 but I think uHu posted some more specific details of that in the 100 series forum.

 

[Graham]

Howdy folks...

I'm thinking of upgrading to a 120, LC3 or LC4 for towing my twin axle van down to the south of France next year, my current LC only gets 14mpg when towing, so need something more economical.

I sat with Chris the other night talking through lots of vehicle options, I was quite keen on the Amazon 100, however I'm not really any better off with fuel so that kinda defeats the object.

Next was the 120, from my understanding from Chris the LC5 is the muts nuts with all the gadgets include a possible troublesome air suspension on the earlier models, for this reason I'm thinking maybe the LC4, the last thing I need is to be in trouble in the middle of France with 2 kids a nagging wife and poorly car

I don't want to spend any more than 10k including whatever I get for my motor.
I like the gadgets, especially a built in sat nav.
I'm thinking I want manual for towing, however I'm not sure if this makes as much difference wth the D4D engine and 5 spd box as it does with the 90s
I'm not in any rush as I wont be going to EU untill next year, also I'm gagging for the snow to come so I can try out my BFG mud tyres !
So what do you guys think who own them ? please let me know all the pro's and con's and which one you'd advise

Cheers,

.
Here.
Less than £8k
.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2003-Toyota-L ... 336b6b9abc
.
Graham

 

[BIG clean GREEN]

Looks like it's gone Graham !

Which models come with a sun roof as std ?

The 100 does appeal to me, however I also need to consider over all fuel consumption and not just for towing, what hacks me off with mine is not using it as much as I'd like to because of the mpg, I tend to do lengthy runs in SWMBO's mini cooper

The LC4 looks favourite at the moment, but as with most things it all depends on the spondoonies at the right time, maybe the LC5 will have to wait untill the next motor change !

Coincidentally if you know of anyone interested in a nice clean 95, big clean green will be up for grabs, if you haven't seen it then Chris will surely vouch for how tidy it is !

Regards,