LJ70 Build Thread!

[Ben]

what tire pressures you running? - looks like you could drop them on the slippy stuff?

tyres definetly needed dropping, but i hadnt got an accurate tyre gauge with me, so i didnt.

i dropped them down to 10psi at the last lincomb and it made a huge difference.

i want to get an ARB deflater.

Speaking of intelligent chargers Jon, what's a reasonable one to buy I think this may have been asked before

There was a thread about it somewhere I'm sure but I don't know what's available at the moment.

this is the one im thinking of buying.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/330689827969? ... _993wt_698

I think you will find 6 amp a bit under powered especially for dual batteries, 20amps or higher would be more like it IMO.

thanks John, i will look for a more powerful one.

Some nice work there Ben, been following your front axle stuff closely as Ill be rebuilding both swivels on mine shortly after Lincomb (as well as doing the cam belt and injectors). Im on holiday in Florida (Lovely sunshine and 30*C! ) and Ive just received my trunnion bearing eliminator kit and a few other gooddies from Trail Gear to bring back with me.

Keep us posted on the battery/charging/alternator issue as I seem to have a similar issue ie: 2 fairly new batteries not holding charge/not charging properly from the alternator. Ive found that even with a sufficiently rated smart charger the batteries charge better separately and dissconnected from the vehicle.

thanks Dave.

id be interested to see some pics when you fit your trail gear bits.

after charging both batteries overnight, there both showing about 12 volts, but ive still got no power to anything, the ignition lights come on but there very faint.

my mate is coming shortly with his booster/charger so we can get it running then im going to take it to my local automotive place and get them to put there tester on it which should determine whether its the batteries, alternator or both at fault.

either way its going to cost me a few hundred pounds.

if its the alternator then it will be a mad rush to get to milners before they close at 12.30pm to pick up an alternator, so i can get it fitted and fixed ready for laning tomorrow.

if its batteries i might just buy some normal ones.

 

[Chas]

thanks John, i will look for a more powerful one.

Me too

 

[Ben]

damm i hate electrical faults!!!!!

fitted 2 new 100amp batteries this morning, and its been fine all day, started it twice and it started perfectly both times. drove it about 5 miles and it drove perfectly, and the voltmeter was showing what it would normally show, about halfway.

just come to go out, jumped in turned the key and it cranked over about half a turn.

all electrical items have been switched off all day, so i cant think what would have drained the new batteries.

ive just put the multi meter on the batteries and they were showing 12+ volts but still it wouldnt start. just tried starting it again, and the multi meter is now showing 16volts.

any ideas?

i cant work out if something some where is draining the batteries. and if that is the case then why is the voltage on the multimeter still quite high.

or is there a fault with the starting circuit, which seems strange because it fired straight up as soon as the new batteries were fitted.

 

[sae70]

You could have a shorted diode in the alternator Ben, disconnect the alternator (pull out large plug) charge batteries and see if they drain overnight again. The best thing to do before doing this really would be to connect a multimeter between the negative battery cable and the negative terminal post on the battery, this may not be so simple for you to do dependant upon your twin battery set up, and may be easier if you loose one of the batteries for this test. If you find a draw of more than 25-50 milliamperes there's a draw large enough to cause a significant drain overnight! If you do this and find a large draw then disconnect the alternator and see if it drops, if not pull each fuse in turn checking the meter each time and relays the same till you find the offending circuit. Use the 20Amp connection on your multimeter not the milliamperes one! Also did you not mention a fault with your glow plugs / glow plug relay, timmers? I had a really annoying fault with my glow plug system on Snowy that I never got to the bottom of before I sold her, even after fitting two new glow plug relay / timmers and three sets of new glow plugs! She just kept burning them out every couple of weeks!!! Maybe worth disconnecting this circuit for elimination as you've had troubles with it.

Good luck, give me a call if you need a chat

Edit - You may need to wait for the truck to go to sleep after first connecting the multimeter up (ECU & Alarm) for a few minutes, so don't jump to pulling fuses untill you've waited for a bit

 

[Ben]

thanks Steven, thats a huge help.

i suspect i may have gone and spent £200 on batteries unnecessarily!

i will carry out the test(s) you suggest and report back.

ECU and alarm? what are they then?

 

[Scott]

i want to get an ARB deflater.

This one is the same gauge, but under a different name, and cheaper: http://4x4overlander.com/tyre-equipment ... lator.html

Also did you not mention a fault with your glow plugs / glow plug relay, timmers?

I'm of the same opinion as Steven, inadvertently leaving the glow plugs switched on was what caused this problem, so I'd be giving that circuit a good looking over.

Generally glow plugs are only designed to work for a short period, where they glow red hot, having left them on for a long period the glow plug itself might be shorting the batteries out during the starting process. Or the wiring in the glow plug circuit might be melted, and shorting/draining the batteries.

I'd give the glow plug circuit a good going over, and if your unsure, disconnect the glow plug circuit completely, chances are the motor will still start as its not that cold out.

You've mastered a lot of skills during, and because of your land cruiser ownership, I'm sure with some Internet research you can get your head round the electrical side as well. Just keep the smoke inside the wires

Good luck.

 

[Ben]

thanks Scott, great link. ive not seen them that cheap before.

ive noticed ironman and ARB all sell the same as the one on your link, just with there name on it.

going to have a good look at the electrical system after tomorrows laning trip.

going to bump start my truck using my mates hi-lux and will then leave the truck running all day, and then disconnect the batteries when i get home and turn the truck off.

vehicle electrics is definitely something i need to learn more about and get my head around.

thanks.

 

[Ben]

so what have i done on my truck today...............................

i went and picked up some new batteries this morning.

there a bit bigger than my old ones, but these were the ones the computer said were for my truck.

discovered that the front battery tray is bigger than the rear one.
so the battery fitted in the front tray fine, but wouldnt fit the back one.

wouldnt quite go down far enough.

2 options then. change the one battery for a smaller, but also lower amps battery, and get £20 back. or keep the bigger battery and mod the battery tray.

so i decided the mod the battery tray.

needed to cut the side bits off, and drill some new holes to attach the fibreglass tray to the metal side brackets,.

cut off.

bolted a little angle bracket on.

done.

battery tray and battery fitted.

the batteries were showing 15.97 with the engine off.

and 17.41 with the engine running, so i guess this means the alternator is kicking out some power?

so to hopefully prevent anymore flat batteries due to me stupidly forgetting to turn stuff off, i decided to make sure everything was being controlled by ignition lives!

worked out which terminal in the power outlet box becomes live when the ignition is switched on.

and connected a wire to it.

this was then run through the bulkhead into the truck, where it was then connected to the switches which control the relays for the fuel heater, glow plugs, electric fan, and the digital temp gauge.

all wired up and back together. its nice having the temp gauge wired up so it comes on with the ignition, after running it off the cigarette lighter point for so long.

next thing to look at was the front panhard rod, because the death wobble is starting to come back!

looking underneath with some one turning the steering wheel gently i could see the chassis end of the panhard rod moving.

so i unbolted that end.

bush looked ok.

i pushed the metal sleeve out expecting to find the bush totally destroyed, but i was pleasantly surprised to see it intact.

not very clear in the pic, but looking down the rod it looks bent in the middle. im sure it wasnt bent before, but then i havnt done anything that could have bent it.

going to source another one and get it fitted.

i found that the bolt that attaches the panhard rod to the chassis was quite loose inside the metal bush sleeve, but also quite loose in the holes in the chassis. so maybe this was causing some/the movement.

a quick look in my bolt box revealed a bolt that was a mm or 2 thicker than the one i removed, and so was a much tighter fit in the sleeve and chassis holes. its a very high tensile fine thread bolt and was off another jap 4x4 so i dont doubt its strong enough.

hopefully it cures the death wobble.

was hosing out the inside of the truck and noticed that water was getting trapped beneath the sound insulation on the floor pan.

levered some off with a big screwdriver, and found a bit of surface rust underneath.

decided to take it all off.

looking at it im pretty sure its asbestos, but it all popped off easily so im not too worried.

quite a bit of rust underneath, so im glad i caught it now, as if left, in a few years time i might be able to drive Fred Flintstone style.

gave it a good wash.

passenger side wasnt quite as bad.

dont really want to use this rust treatment anymore on my truck, as ive noticed it only lasts a few months, until the rust starts coming through the paint, that is put on top of the converted rust.

but as i havnt got any dintrol yet, it will do for now.

started sorting everything out for my laning trip tomorrow.

put 15 litres of veg oil in each jerry can, ready to be topped up with diesel when i call stop at a fuel station. roll on summer when i can run 100%!

truck all loaded up and ready to go.

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

The bolt in the panhard rod is not supposed to be a very snug fit in the bush sleeve, it is supposed to be done up tight enough that the sleeve is clamped in place and can't move. Not sure why you're still having problems if you're doing it up tight enough but double check the torque figure you're using?

Those voltages look very high, or is it just me?

 

[sae70]

Those voltages look very high, or is it just me?

Yep!!! They do seem high!? The first reading of 15.97 Volts I assume is what your getting from the new batteries connected together in parallel having not been charged. If so then assuming they are 100% charged then they would be around 12.6 Volts (13.2 Volts @ most). Im not certain of what effect on the voltage having two connected in parallel would have, but assuming no effect then it could be that your multimeter is reading plus 21% Then with the engine running and providing the perfect charge voltage the reading should be between 13.2 & 14.4 Volts but certainly no more! Interestingly 14.4 Volts plus 21% is about 17.42 Volts and so would suggest that your meter is not entirely accurate, but the only way to confirm this would be to compare its readings to another meter. If the rectifier in your alternator has gone and is allowing 17 plus volts out you'll very quickly shag those new batteries m8!!!! The Boiling (gassing) voltage for 12 Volt automotive batteries is anything over 14.4 Volts!!

Not sure how that all reads, hope it makes sense!

Late, must be off to bed

 

[Scott]

Those are very high readings With the batteries wired in parallel (positive to pos & negative to neg), as they look to be, you should only be seeing a reading around 12.6v.

Something doesn't look right there. Do you know that the multimeter is giving a true reading? If your unsure, stick it on your mums Vectra and see what you get.

As Steven has said, if you are getting 17+v with the engine running, your new batteries are unlikely to last the day. You could try disconnecting your alternator and seeing what affect that has on your readings.

 

[Ben]

John, im wondering if when the panhard rod was loose before, whether its enlarged/elongated the holes on the chassis where it bolts on, and maybe thats why the bolt was so loose?

maybe i need to weld some washers onto the chassis over the holes.

thanks for the replies on the electrical fault(s) guys.

the multimeter could well be faulty, im sure when i tried it on the vectra yesterday that was also giving high readings.

just checked the vectra now, its showing 12.5v. just gone to start it to see wht its showing when running, and the battery on that is bloody dead aswell!

WTF is going on? it was running fine yesterday, and theres never been a problem with it having a flat battery before, no lights stereo etc. were left on yesterday either.

 

[jeepmadmike]

I think yor multimeter is wrong a fully charged lead acid car battery isn't going to read 16volts check it on some normal dry cell AA or simular batteries

Your truck should start fine on one battery, batteries connected in parallel can cause alsorts of issues

The wiring looks interesting on your toy shame your not local to me I could have a look see.

It sounds to me like a poor connection in there somewhere

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

John, im wondering if when the panhard rod was loose before, whether its enlarged/elongated the holes on the chassis where it bolts on, and maybe thats why the bolt was so loose?

It shouldn't really matter if the bolt hole is a bit enlarged, AFAIK all the bolt is supposed to do is provide clamping force so when tight enough the bush sleeve can't move and so won't ever move the bolt.

 

[sae70]

just checked the vectra now, its showing 12.5v. just gone to start it to see what its showing when running, and the battery on that is bloody dead aswell!

Can't help you With regards to WTF is going on, but a reading of 12.5 Volts suggests a fully charged battery (12.6 Volts). If your Multimeter does have a linear 21% in accuracy then the true reading is around 9.88 Volts and if this is true then that battery is flat.

I copied this info from Wiki for you

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_battery

The open circuit voltage, is measured when the engine is off and no loads are connected.

It can be approximately related to the charge of the battery by:

Approximate Open circuit voltage

12.60 V 100%
12.35 V 75%
12.10 V 50%
11.95 V 25%
11.70 V 0%

Open circuit voltage is also affected by temperature, and the specific gravity of the electrolyte at full charge.

The following is common for a six-cell automotive lead-acid battery at room temperature:

Quiescent (open-circuit) voltage at full charge: 12.6 V
Fully discharged: 11.8 V
Charge with 13.2–14.4 V
Gassing voltage: 14.4 V
Continuous-preservation charge with max. 13.2 V
After full charge the terminal voltage will drop quickly to 13.2 V and then slowly to 12.6 V
Open circuit voltage is measured 12 hours after charging to allow surface charge to dissipate and enable a more accurate reading.
All voltages are at 20 °C, and must be adjusted -0.022V/°C for temperature changes (negative temperature coefficient - lower voltage at higher temperature).

It's clear that you have a fault of some kind with the electrics in the truck & the Vectra for that matter, hopefully the Vectra just has a flat battery that needs a charge. But you can't make any real progress even with the basics untill you can prove the accuracy of you multimeter or borrow one that you know to be giving a true reading.

For example if you could be sure of the charge voltage on the truck being 14.4 Volts or less then you could go out without endangering the life of your new batteries, it would be better if the charge voltage was slightly less than 14.4 Volts as this is the very upper limit before gassing starts in a 12 Volt lead acid battery.

 

[John_McCartney]

Your truck should start fine on one battery

If it's the same set up as on my KZJ it won't start on one battery ever - and that's been so with me for all the 11 years I've owned it.

 

[jeepmadmike]

Your truck should start fine on one battery

If it's the same set up as on my KZJ it won't start on one battery ever - and that's been so with me for all the 11 years I've owned it.

My KZJ only has one battery....

The starter is a good design with gear reduction It should be fine unless it's really chilly but mine has always started in sunny! Devon

 

[Jimbo4x4]

Hi ben, other things to check regarding the elec probs; put the multimeter between the + terminal and the engine, then the + terminal and the body on both batteries and check against the batt readings. This will tell you if you have a bad earth strap somewhere. Also, clean inside the terminal clamps with a wire brush and grease them up. It's amazing how quickly they can fur up if they're not greased

 

[Ben]

thanks guys, lots of things for me to check tomorrow.

my truck will not start off one battery and never has.

just got home from an amazing, and fairly eventful day laning.

pics to follow very soon!

 

[Ben]

bump started my truck this morning using my mates hi-lux.

didnt get too far before the death wobble became too much.

so out with a ratchet strap to try strapping the panhard rod, and hopefully stop the dw.

this defiantly made the drive there bearable.

met the others at mcdonalds, 2 x suzuki jimnys, a vitara and another 3litre 70 being driven by Shaun.

first lane.

second lane which i cant remember the name of, saw us climbing steeply out of a village.

half way up the lane we came across a bunch of lame rovers. they were on there first lane of the day, and surprise surprise one of them had broken down.

a TD5 disco had no drive to the rear axle and was struggling to climb the lane with only front wheel drive on crap tyres.

they were using what looked like a ratchet strap to try and snatch recover the landy and drag it up the hill. no gear and no idea was what sprung to mind.

after waiting 10 minutes while this bunch of idiots tried to move the broken landy, we decided to reverse all the way back down and move onto the next lane.

the next lane was the V gulley! id seen pics of this lane before but never driven it.

on the way there, Gary the driver of the jimny in front of me said hed driven it loads of times and that if i didnt want to end up on my side, i should follow his line.

so what happened next?

after picking myself up off the floor from laughing, he got back in and with me and a few of the others pushing the roof and truck over, he managed to roll back down the lane until it was back on its wheels.

doing this meant the damage was minimal.

broken window, mirror and 1 dent.

hes normally a good driver, maybe he wasnt concentrating, or had just become complacent.

suffice to say i didnt follow Gary's line.

top of the lane and i got some bin bags, blue roll and duck tape out of my drawer, and we repaired the window to keep the rain out.

2 gorgeous SWB 3 litre 70's!

so after repairing the window, we went back down the V gulley.

pheasant pen steps was in a much better state to last time i was there, looks like theyve had a big machine in digging drainage ditches. ok its still a mess, but its passable without causing damage, or without the risk of getting stuck.

turned around at the bottom and drove back up.

splashy lane next, couldnt believe how deep some of the water was.

wayfarer next.

again lots of water.

last lane of the day.

my mate had never seen corwen car wash before, so i said id show him the ford on the way back, but i knew we wouldnt be able to drive it today.

panhard rod ratcheted back up for the journey home, and we headed home.

was a great day, and my truck was faultless. turned it on and off a few times, and had lots
of electrical stuff turned on all day, seemed fine.

used my lockers a few times.

3 weeks till our next trip, which im leading. need to get out the maps and plan a days laning around Shropshire with some new lanes for the others, as well as a few of my favourites!