The people have spoken

[goodoldboy]

Tell us something we don't know

Seems ironic though that while your dead set against capitalist democracy you seem to favour governance by those with absolute immunity to consequence

Soooooooooo , would this virus not exist were it not for capitalism ?

I'm sure we can all agree 100% that there would be no vaccine without the evil capitalist funds to produce it .

I'm tired of hearing people who voted for Brexit were fooled by lies so i will counter , sheep were herded blindfold en masse once before toward a bigger better brighter future and all they had to do was go with the flow , Scientists , journalists , the poorest and the millionaires either full on supported it or simply accepted with a don't rock the boat kind of attitude that Adolf's idealism would lead them to a wonderful new world . And he would undoubtedly have succeeded in creating his version of that world had he not become an isolated dictator in full public view .
Fortunately it never occurred to him that he could achieve so much more as a part of an unidentifiable group working in shadows with absolute immunity towards that very same utopia .

We did not vote for something , we voted in objection to going with the flow , we do not want the future the EU project dictates .

Capitalist democracy ? an oxymoron surely ? Giving authority to someone you haven't met to do what they like for 5 years isn't my idea of democracy. I've said before , more than once , that i share many of your concerns about the consolidation of power in the EU but my position is that Brexit won't address this - it's a frying pan/fire dichotomy , false IMO.
Would the virus exist without capitalism ? yeah of course but without intensive farming on a global scale the chances of it crossing into the human population would be lessened . Governments in the developed world with a few exception have put profit before health giving the excuse that we have to trade lives to avoid large parts of the citizenry becoming homeless and destitute - what a shit system. Even under the restraints of capitalism a fair few countries have done better than the USA & UK .Tiawan is a good example of what can be done.
" I'm sure we can all agree 100% that there would be no vaccine without the evil capitalist funds to produce it "
everything that Humans have achieved on this planet only needed two things - Humans and the planet. So are you saying that without profit no vaccine would have been produced ? a lot of research is done in publicly funded universities by folks who live on poverty wages whilst doing PHDs and Doctorates .But you are partly correct in that many life saving medicines are denied to the poor (and not so poor) because of the desire to gouge profit from humanities most basic needs - take a look at the problems that diabetics have in the USA.
I've asked you repeatedly to define the difference between unaccountable power in Westminster & in Brussels .You talk about " Hedge Funds, Investment Banks, Oligarchs the kind of people who don't like democracy " as if they don't exist in the UK & how Brexit will somehow bring some sort of gain for odinary folks by lessening the restraints on out rulers.
Your glorious leaders in the UK have spent 22 billion so far on track and trace - might as well given it to the KLF to set fire to - and that's without all the other billions handed out to their mates and your'e still banging on about getting away from an unaccoutable mafia ?

 

[SteveJB]

Chair and Goodoldboy spose the wet nurse be available

 

[SteveJB]

The KLF was ok for Tammy Winnet brackets spelt wrong brackets with the Justified Ancients Of Moo Moo or am I playing the wrong track

 

[Shayne]

Why is Corbyn not PM of 66 million people when he has a popularity rating about 4 times greater than Juncker ever did while President of 500 million people ?

Off course popular is a dirty word nowadays if people want it then it must be far right extremism don't you know and so giving them what they don't want is the only way forward .

 

[goodoldboy]

Corbyn not being PM is a whole different debate .The president of the EU doesn't have the same powers as Boris .

 

[Shayne]

(quote) Fortunately it never occurred to him that he could achieve so much more as a part of an unidentifiable group working in shadows with absolute immunity towards that very same utopia .

 

[chadr]

This made me chuckle.....

 

[Grimbo]

Good old boy said
"Would the virus exist without capitalism ? yeah of course but without intensive farming on a global scale the chances of it crossing into the human population would be lessened "

Intensive farming had nothing to do with the way the virus spread.... it started because people in Chine eat bats, dogs and pangolins to name but a few.... and things like Wet markets exist ..... and the people who live in this communist state are in many cases so poor they can't afford to eat anything else ...
The Chinese have an appalling record for animal rights and are responsible for the trade in many of the worlds most endangered species ....on the whole not a nice bunch .

 

[goodoldboy]

Intensive farming had nothing to do with the way the virus spread....

I stand corrected But..... .And yes China is a despotic regime where human and animal rights count for nothing but intensive farming is often justified by saying that it's to provide affordable food to the masses.As for them being communist , that's what it says on the tin but not my idea of communism .

 

[chapel gate]

I stand corrected But..... .And yes China is a despotic regime where human and animal rights count for nothing but intensive farming is often justified by saying that it's to provide affordable food to the masses.As for them being communist , that's what it says on the tin but not my idea of communism .

Dammit!

You tricked me into reading something from the guardian...

 

[goodoldboy]

You tricked me into reading something from the guardian

same has happened to me mate with the Torygraph & the Daily Heil .

 

[chapel gate]

 

[Shayne]

The plague that caused the Black Death originated in China in the early to mid-1300s and spread along trade routes westward to the Mediterranean and northern Africa. It reached southern England in 1348 and northern Britain and Scandinavia by 1350.

Fake news in Encyclopaedia Britannica no doubt

 

[chadr]

The plague that caused the Black Death originated in China in the early to mid-1300s and spread along trade routes westward to the Mediterranean and northern Africa. It reached southern England in 1348 and northern Britain and Scandinavia by 1350.

Fake news in Encyclopaedia Britannica no doubt

Didn't realise that was ever in doubt....has it been refuted here? I must have missed that post.

 

[Shayne]

Nah something i read here about modern causes made my mind wander and led to me reading about the Black Death and the Great famine that preceded it . Way back in 1315 the rich got fed and the poor didn't because for better or for worse that's human nature and so it will always be .

 

[Iwan]

Some interesting info/facts as they come to surface..

Here's an idea.... lets vote to destroy our trade network! I'd put lol to conclude my post but It ain't funny at all!

 

[Grimbo]

Several mates are owner driver hauliers who often run to Europe..... apart from a few delays where the French are either deliberately or more likely just badly organised with paperwork it has all gone smoothly and they are still helping out French company's with internal loads too .
I buy a fair amount of parts from Holland, Belgium and France for older vehicles and that has carried on pretty much as usual ...an initial fear that postage costs would rise massively also seems to be unfounded ....
Not everything is going smoothly but it's nothing like the disaster certain sides predicted and the mainstream media are not going to report anything positive about post brexit ....

 

[Shayne]

Thanks Grimbo you reminded me to read the text i got today from fisheries and it says they won't be texting me umpteen times a day any more with licence variation notifications (quota changes) which in turn reminds me i forgot to print off my unrequested automatically sent permit to land fish into EU ports , i got distracted while signing a single sheet of paper for my fish processor . The bureaucracy is killing me

 

[chadr]

I buy a fair amount of parts from Holland, Belgium and France for older vehicles and that has carried on pretty much as usual ...an initial fear that postage costs would rise massively also seems to be unfounded ....

That's good to hear.

I did hear from some UK suppliers (anecdotally) that buyers in the EU now have to pay tax or duty (VAT? I don't know) on UK goods and that the company delivering (DPD/UPS etc) have to collect that on behalf of HMRC. So they are now adding on an admin/handling charge (around £20-25) to cover that. So effectively a £100 item now has both tax/ duty and a handling charge levied on it making it around 50% more expensive.

I thought that process would be reciprocated on the UK side too for inbound EU goods. So we would have similar EU tax/duty to pay upon delivery.

Can someone that actually deals in this confirm? Thanks.

 

[Grimbo]

That's good to hear.

I did hear from some UK suppliers (anecdotally) that buyers in the EU now have to pay tax or duty (VAT? I don't know) on UK goods and that the company delivering (DPD/UPS etc) have to collect that on behalf of HMRC. So they are now adding on an admin/handling charge (around £20-25) to cover that. So effectively a £100 item now has both tax/ duty and a handling charge levied on it making it around 50% more expensive.

I thought that process would be reciprocated on the UK side too for inbound EU goods. So we would have similar EU tax/duty to pay upon delivery.

Can someone that actually deals in this confirm? Thanks.

I have a load of parts coming from Holland ... produced probably in 1944 in the USA , will let you know when they arrive how the customs side goes but certainly from the suppliers side his delivery charge is about what it has always been ...given that some of the parts are literally the last new ones anywhere in the world obviously we don't use the cheapest option sometimes .