Beware travelling in Spain!

[Matthew1955]

It has been said in Spanish circles the Gaurdia Civil are not compatible with EU thinking, so the Spanish government has tried to distance itself a little by reducing funding, this means the GC has to generate more revenue for themselves.

Having been stopped by the GC more times in a month than my entire previous years the UK, you would think it a little overbearing. The reality is they are with the odd exception very polite and will have you on your way with minimal fuss.

OK arse crawling over for English reading GC


Regards

Dave

What I was told by the locals was dont worry about the local police they are more interested in how cool they looked in the fancy shades than anything else but DO worry about the GC,they are a hangover from Franco,s personal army with their machine guns at the ready but I have to agree I always found them to be courteous and polite.I so miss living in Spain.

 

[Dave2000]

Yep local cops are great, we have 4 IIRC? One often gets in local bars and plays a guitar, another spends time just out of town in a house of ill repute, only a rumour of course.

GC are ok, like anything else, show a little respect and the wheels start turning freely. A couple of weeks back I got stopped for speeding, I explained I was getting hassled by the tourists and had put my foot down at the first piece of dual carriageway to get around them, he found I lived local and sent me on my way, laughing he said just have patience they will be gone soon.

Regards

Dave

 

[goodoldboy]

The GC seem to be on a purge here , one of their favourite places us a roundabout - one of those too small Mickey mouse jobs.I treat roundabouts as a give way unlike most Spanish drivers here who nearly always stop ( I live in the back of beyond) so I almost always take em by surprise .that & RHD means I'm off before they have time to flag me down.But still I hate this sort of bullshit , nothing to do with road safety , just a way of gouging more money out of us.

 

[Dave2000]

I am sending this from outside one of the ITV (MOT) stations in Spain.

I have just met not one but two English people in English plated cars. Both going for the voluntary inspection, so they can keep their vehicles in Spain for another year. IT IS NOT A RECOGNISED LEGAL MOT!!

I pointed this out and got the usual "my mate said this or that so it must be ok.".

IT IS NOT!! The voluntary test is for your own peace of mind that there are no major issues with your vehicle, nothing more and nothing less, perhaps your UK MOT run out and you are about to drive (illegaly) back to England?

If you are stopped or worse have an accident YOU ARE NOT COVERED!!

Sorry for shouting but one of these guys is in a 4x4 (not LC), but you would have thought the message had somehow got around, this rule has been around for about 20+ years?

Regards

Dave

 

[clivehorridge]

Can't carry shopping in the passenger compartment of a vehicle? The world's gone mad!

When is shopping "shopping" and not something you've already bought? The trend here at the supermarkets is for large strong re-usable shopping bags. We often use them to carry "stuff" ranging from smaller articles, clothing, bed linen, shopping and whatever. It goes in the back of the truck in the load area, but on top of the folded down seat backs of the 3rd row of the 80.

Im suggesting that sorting out (legally defining) what is passenger and what is load area, as well as what is shopping and what is belongings (same thing in my book) sounds like a massive legal conundrum.

The lawyers must love it when they get such a case

 

[Dave2000]

Agree Clive, look at my 8 seater 80, it can only be presented for test WITH the rearmost seats ...you know, the ones that carry passengers complete with belts ....fitted in place in the luggage area!

Of course if I pop over to Almeria, the test can be carried out with 8 seats........but one rearmost seat belt must be removed, so I can only carry 7 people!

Regards

Dave

 

[clivehorridge]

Agree Clive, look at my 8 seater 80, it can only be presented for test WITH the rearmost seats ...you know, the ones that carry passengers complete with belts ....fitted in place in the luggage area!

Of course if I pop over to Almeria, the test can be carried out with 8 seats........but one rearmost seat belt must be removed, so I can only carry 7 people!

Regards

Dave

Yep, only 7 people, and still no room for legal shopping!

 

[Dave2000]

Ah, but if a hitch hiker stands on the border of Murcia he can have a lift as an 8th person............as long as he has brought a seat belt with him!

Regards

Dave

 

[clivehorridge]

Ah, but if a hitch hiker stands on the border of Murcia he can have a lift as an 8th person............as long as he has brought a seat belt with him!

Regards

Dave

.... and he hadn't been shopping...

 

[Ben]

I appreciate the topic has moved on somewhat from the originl discussion but incase member are unaware it is illegal to wear open backed shoes,ie crocs,flip flops ect while driving in Spain and to wear a hat in an open topped car,I guess in case it blows off into the path of the vehicle behind .When I lived there ( 2006-2012) by misses was fined 120Euros for wearing crocs when she was checked over at one of the tempory road side police check points.

Just out of curiosity...........

Its illegal to drive in flip flops or crocs, what about bare foot?

Over here I drive bare foot 99% of the time.

 

[Dave2000]

Just out of curiosity...........

Its illegal to drive in flip flops or crocs, what about bare foot?

Over here I drive bare foot 99% of the time.

Good point, I know a few people who drive barefoot and no one seems to know if it is legal or not? The argument for banning footwear that can come off, is that it can come loose and jam under the brake pedal.

I will try and find out next time I am near the GC office.

Regards

Dave

 

[grantw]

Just out of curiosity...........

Its illegal to drive in flip flops or crocs, what about bare foot?

Over here I drive bare foot 99% of the time.

I didn't think (but don't know for sure) that bare foot was legal in Oz.

 

[Dave2000]

It is not uncommon for me to be contacted to 'matriculate' (register) a car for someone planning to use their non Spanish registered car here in Spain, with the Spanish police all over anyone caught here with a non registered car still in the country for more than six months, registrations are on the up.

As it is legal 'stuff' and my spanish is perhaps rated about 4 out of 10, I use a translator who I have to pay. In general it is pretty straightforward and I am ok with the procedure however, about six months ago a couple from Belgium ask me to start the process to import their Volvo estate, they are neighbours of mine, no problem. After contacting the relevant authorities and giving them the initial list of what's needed they were going to contact me to complete the process, I find out later that they used the documents I (with the translator) had collected for them and went ahead and completed the process themselves and saved a few euros, they know they owe me for the translator and will pay me when they get around to it, that was about a year ago, No money, not a thank you nada, I noted that when we cross paths they do not mention it but smile red faced and move on, sure they know they owe me as I have asked twice and they seem to have forgotten.....again. I am not petty enough to mention it anymore......think about punching him in the face yes...but mention it. .....nah, so why bring it up now? Well I thought recent events made this post worthwhile.

If you park in a 'menos validos' or 'handicapped' space in Spain to save a couple of euros on a parking meter, you WILL get fined, this neighbour of mine did just that.

Having the handicapped card in your window without the handicapped person (his mother in law) in the car or the handicapped person is in the car but does not LEAVE the car to enter a shop or whatever making genuine use of the marked space, you will get a 200 Euro fine, reduced to 100 if (as a resident) you pay within 30 days.

My 'tighter than a ducks arse under water' neighbour having been caught paid 100 euros under protest but later appealed in court, and his defence? "The police in Belgium never bother to fine anyone for such a frivolous offence."

So after paying 1000 euros for a solicitor, a further 900 euros in court costs, and the travel costs to Valencia where the offence was committed he now knows three things:

1, In Spain if caught parking in a handicapped space you will be fined.

2, The Spanish judges don't give a toss about what the police do in Belgium.

3, In Spain Karma is strong!

Regards

Dave

 

[frank rabbets]

Interesting attitude Dave. Spend 1000 euros to save 100, That's really tight lol.

 

[stumog]

Very nice.

Dave can you register a modified vehicle in Spain?

So if for argument we moved over with my 80 that has been built could I register that or have to put back to standard?

 

[Rodger]

I'll jump in here as I've registered a modified vehicle here in Spain - my 40 - but it is pre-1985 which is when the VIN numbers were unified (17 digits). Even so it wasn't easy or cheap to do - nearly 2 years and nearly 1700 euros plus a trip back to the UK to get the intervening MOT.
Primarily it does depend on the state you are in - some it's an absolute no-no while others are a bit more lenient e.g, Our local ITV station (only 35 kms away) just laughed whereas the one we go which is 60 kms away did the registration with us but we have to return there every year. That station is in Almeria(province) whereas we live in Granada (province) but they are both a part of Andalusia - hence Dave's comment about 7 versus 8 seats as Murcia is a separate state.
Undoubtedly Dave will be able to shed more light on this subject but as an example the Harley club (HOG) in Granada have an arrangement with the local HD dealer - they take all the non stock parts off just before the ITV(MOT), put them in a box, get the bike tested and then refit the non-stock items and obviously charge the customer.
Having said that one does see modified vehicles around which are post 1985 but they tend to be connected to some aspect of motorsport - e.g. rallying or off-road, etc, so it must be possible but an excellent command of the language is undoubtedly necessary to go that route. We have been to the local extreme off road events and a member lives local to me - he said not to join as they don't do the tracks and dry river beds etc that we do and having watched their events I wouldn't put my 40 through that - they have no mechanical sympathy at all! - even though their trucks get driven on the road. But having said that they make us welcome when we show up at their events.
Ultimately it is down to the area and how modified the vehicle is, i.e. can the parts be removed for the test.
One has to remember that the bureaucracy in Spain is a hang over from Franco - who ensured that his dictatorship had a completely controlled population - and although Spain reinstated the monarchy in 1975 the officialdom was never brought up to date. And referring to earlier sections of this thread, the GC were his private army.

Regards,
Rodger

 

[moggy1968]

I'll jump in here as I've registered a modified vehicle here in Spain - my 40 - but it is pre-1985 which is when the VIN numbers were unified (17 digits). Even so it wasn't easy or cheap to do - nearly 2 years and nearly 1700 euros plus a trip back to the UK to get the intervening MOT.
Primarily it does depend on the state you are in - some it's an absolute no-no while others are a bit more lenient e.g, Our local ITV station (only 35 kms away) just laughed whereas the one we go which is 60 kms away did the registration with us but we have to return there every year. That station is in Almeria(province) whereas we live in Granada (province) but they are both a part of Andalusia - hence Dave's comment about 7 versus 8 seats as Murcia is a separate state.
Undoubtedly Dave will be able to shed more light on this subject but as an example the Harley club (HOG) in Granada have an arrangement with the local HD dealer - they take all the non stock parts off just before the ITV(MOT), put them in a box, get the bike tested and then refit the non-stock items and obviously charge the customer.
Having said that one does see modified vehicles around which are post 1985 but they tend to be connected to some aspect of motorsport - e.g. rallying or off-road, etc, so it must be possible but an excellent command of the language is undoubtedly necessary to go that route. We have been to the local extreme off road events and a member lives local to me - he said not to join as they don't do the tracks and dry river beds etc that we do and having watched their events I wouldn't put my 40 through that - they have no mechanical sympathy at all! - even though their trucks get driven on the road. But having said that they make us welcome when we show up at their events.
Ultimately it is down to the area and how modified the vehicle is, i.e. can the parts be removed for the test.
One has to remember that the bureaucracy in Spain is a hang over from Franco - who ensured that his dictatorship had a completely controlled population - and although Spain reinstated the monarchy in 1975 the officialdom was never brought up to date. And referring to earlier sections of this thread, the GC were his private army.

Regards,
Rodger

What counts as modified? Different seats? 16 inch wheels instead of 15? 235x85 tyres instead of 7.50x16? After market heavy duty springs?

 

[Rodger]

Seats would be okay although we take our harnesses out and refit the lap straps for the test. Wheel and tyre sizes different from original specification is definitely a no-no without an engineers (Spanish) certification (about 300 euros). Springs would be okay as they probably can't tell the difference. But springs would be best fitted before as with some vehicles, like ours, they measure the length and height every time.
Oddly enough, we have two different wheel and tyre sizes registered so naturally enough when we went to our first test we also took the other set, assuming they'd want to see them. But they fill the back and that caused consternation - did it constitute cargo and therefore the truck be a 'commercial'. The answer is very simple - 'We do not need to see the other set at the test' so we no longer take them with us but we can still use them, legally.
I also have to change my wing mirrors as mine have spotter lenses attached and they don't like them so the old girl goes to the test with a set of LR wing mirrors on!

Regards,
Rodger

 

[Dave2000]

Very nice.

Dave can you register a modified vehicle in Spain?

So if for argument we moved over with my 80 that has been built could I register that or have to put back to standard?

Pretty much as per @Rodger post. Generally speaking it has to be as it was when it left the dealer however, you would be surprised what you can do if you do it in the right order, and know the right people, something I did not understand when I first purchased a Spanish registered Land Rover and modified it for competition around 13 years back.

Order being if you are moving here and the vehicle comes with you as 'goods and chattels', this will be a significant saving on import duty. You will definitely have to revert your vehicle to as near stock as possible.

Now, if you bring your armour and snorkel, AND find the right engineer, cross his palm with silver he will invariably get your car through the matriculation process, he will 'find' homogalado codes which will be accepted.

There are other odd things that may occur, my car is legal at one ITV station and not at another in a neighbouring province, it simply is not a level playing field.

when I registered mine it had the stock 275 tyres on, a friend registered his with 285's and it was accepted, it seems there was a model somewhere that had these as OE, so it was accepted. Mine was presented with the stock 8 seats but I had to remove one seat belt, so I would only be able to legally carry 6 passengers, drive into the next province and it is illegal to have a seat fitted without a seat belt..........go figure.

My OE towbar had to be removed as there was no ID tag fitted by Toyota when it left the factory. I had to argue and show an advertising picture that the side steps were original.

If you swap configuration after leaving the inspection station for example, fit different wheels and are then involved in a prang, you may find your insurance is null and void which, IIRC is pretty much the same mantra voiced by UK insurance companies.

Now, having said that, you CAN modify a vehicle but, you should make your purchases such as snorkel, bumpers and so forth from a Spanish company, lo and behold and before you know it they will be acceptable to the ITV station, and 'should' be acceptable to your insurer.

Of course the parts will be very expensive as they have the required codes that are accepted by the ITV Station, but it is the easiest option.

Regards

Dave

 

[goodoldboy]

My experience is pretty similar to yours Dave , a complete racket IMO , with each autonomous region of Spain having its own interpretation of the law. You can have a single homologation on vehicles that dont comply in any other way but i was told that it cost a minimum of 1500 euros! Competition vehicles with FIA papers in order can also be imported.
The whole process is a sort of automotive 3 card Monty with the same results - the punter gets mugged!