France & Spain Route Recommendations please

[Animal Mother]

Hopefully this post is ok here.

We're starting to plan our first big(ish) trip in the LC and it will be to Spain. Mainly to visit my old man who has just moved between Alicante and Murcia.

I plan to blast through most of the distance down to the French/Spanish border, but I'm hoping for some wisdom about a few things.

We want to try and camp as often as possible, so please bear that in mind with your recommendations. The rig will be the LC with a roof tent. Trip time will be about 2 weeks.

1. What's the easiest/quickest way to get to Limoges (I can't see an easy way to get past Paris)?

2. We want to stop in Andorra, what's the best route to there?

3. Any recommended stops between Limoges and Andorra?

4. Is there a smugglers route through the mountains near Andorra? I'm sure I've read that somewhere.

5. Recommendations for places to visit and/or stay between Andorra and Murcia.

6. We are happy to travel on from Murcia, any recommendations on where to go?

7. We fancy going to see the observatories and the Alto Velefique North of the Tabernas desert.

So, any route maps, recommended stops, recommended camping, recommended attractions would be a huge help. Thank you.

 

[lc 120]

The no toll Route we use is as Follows : Calais , Rouen , Evreux , Dreux, Chartres , Orlean, Clermont Ferrand , Millau , Narbonne and then into Spain.
The above route via the A71 / A75 has some steep sections but as long as you have a good power to weight ratio you will be fine and we overnight at Camping Le Clos Auroy south of Clermont Ferrand and just of junction 5 which is very easy to find and is only 3-4 minutes from the Autoroute however it would require a 9+ hours drive in a single day plus stops to get that far....

 

[Bert]

There are some fantastic routes just outside of Espot, just west of Andorra, up in the mountains. Dirt tracks for miles. Beautiful.

 

[Firewout]

Try https://www.park4night.com/?langage=en for camping spots.
They also have an app.

 

[AndyCook]

HAve a look through people's trip reports inthe area for last 8 years.
I have certainly posted a few as have other members

 

[Rodger]

I'm assuming that you don't want to use the toll motorways which are expensive.
Unlike the UK when they built the motorways in France they did not do away with the 'route nationals' but they do go through the medium sized towns (bigger towns usually have toll-free motorways around them).
Personally we've always used the slightly longer crossings Portsmouth-Caen because you can eat and sleep but the route recommended by lc120 above gets you south of Paris although from Rouen I'd go Le Mans - Tours - Poitiers - Limoges - Toulouse - Foix - Andorra. Again I'm assuming that there is a reason for Limoges. Toulouse is a PITA but there are ways round it using the 'D' roads - which are often better than the UK's A roads.
Andorra: There are 3 main campsites but the one in Andorra La Vella is in the middle of the town next to the football pitch - it's okay if you want to wander the shops but there is one up near the start of the Smugglers Pass - I think it's near Xixerella and at the end of the CG-4 road the Smugglers starts. Brings you out at Alins. Alins (Tirvia is worth a look as it is one of 15 villages restored by the government to its pre-civil war look) - Sort - Tremp - Lleida - Follow C12 to Tortosa or if you want a mountain pass road pick up the L702 to Castelldans and then the C233 which joins the c12 at Flix and onto Tortosa - the c12 joins with the N340 - the coast road.
Toll motorways in Spain are prefixed 'AP' but there loads on non-toll motorways. Fuel on m/ways in Spain is the same price as everywhere else.. NB In France no fuel stations are open on Sundays - they debit your credit card (self serve & un-manned) with the number that shows to begin with 100/150/200 euros and refund the difference several days later.
Use the E15 - A7 m/ways round Valencia and as it nears Alicante the AP (toll m/way) is first (obviously trying to get the un-suspecting onto a toll road). And that m/way (A7) finishes back at the N340 so if you want the coast road use the link.
We've never been to the Observatory but if you want to see some parts of the Tabernas desert just let us know when. Campsite just outside Tabernas is ok - nothing special but clean.
Hope that helps.
Regards
Rodger

 

[Animal Mother]

Thank you Rodger!

I'm happy to use the tolls if it makes the journey easier/shorter/quicker. My dad, when he moved down to Alicante last year drove avoiding the tolls and wished he'd used at least some of them, as his journey was very long.

The reason for Limoges was only as a marker really of where I could drive to on the first day in France. I was close to the mark as @lc120 above mentioned Clermond Ferrand as a stop location (after a 9hr journey).

I'll be using the Chanel Tunnel so my journey will start in Calais.

Are there any recommended route planners online other than Google maps?

For now, here is a VERY rough route.

 

[Animal Mother]

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/5...5955f3d80757f3:0x59408ad03cf563ae!1m0!1m0!3e0

 

[Rodger]

Guess I spent too many years pushing an artic around Europe so have an aversion to using m/ways and anyway our 40 only cruises at the speed of the trucks, which we can do on the RNs.
Paris is the hub of the m/ways in France but it does have the Periferic which is like the M25 except the traffic moves, on occasions. You can now travel from Calais to Gibraltar all the way on motorway (last section in Spain opened a couple of years ago) but IMO you don't see the country.
Limoges through Toulouse and to Foix would be best on M/way and there are other sections where you could use m/ways: Abbeyville- Rouen, Alencon - Tours, etc..
I couldn't open the rough route.
I think the RAC & AA and Green Flag all have route planners but tend to use maps (Luddites) and then we can detour to see the things that attract us - but that's just us!

Regards,
Rodger

 

[Animal Mother]

Try this:
https://goo.gl/maps/mTaqyjau3No

 

[Rodger]

Got the route to open...
Is the idea to get down and back as quick as poss or do you want to see other parts? Your route takes you near places like Cazorla and Cuenca but not to them but it depends what you want to get out of the trip.

Regards,
Rodger

 

[Animal Mother]

Got the route to open...
Is the idea to get down and back as quick as poss or do you want to see other parts? Your route takes you near places like Cazorla and Cuenca but not to them but it depends what you want to get out of the trip.

Regards,
Rodger

That's a very rough route so only covers rough direction really. It'll be a 2 week trip so plenty of time to stop places and take in the sights.

 

[Rodger]

Tarragona is heavy industries area, so I'd suggest the route above from Tremp to Tortosa - much prettier and a small mountain range to go over with beautiful views.
There is a new motorway that starts at Xativa and comes down past Alcoi (which is worth a visit) and it cuts a big corner off the route shown (near Valencia).
Your route uses the A92S so if you wanted an off road trail (not difficult) over the Sierra Baza , you could turn off at La Calahorra and pick up the A92N near Baza then take the A319 up to Cazorla and travel the very scenic route to Arroyo de le Dehesa. There is another easy trail that brings you into the south of the Cazorla valley if you want it. No o/r trails in Cazorla as it is a National Park. (I can give you details on both)
A detour to Cuenca (old town) is worthwhile (campsite is 5 kms) and then across the Park Natural de la Serrina de Cuenca rejoining the A23 north of Teruel (Andy has stayed at a campsite around there).

Hope that helps. Always more info available as you define your plans.

Regards,
Rodger

 

[AndyCook]

Teruel:

Yeah we stayed at a campsite at Albarracin
Wonderful fortitifed village and castle
Well worth a visit and easy trails in the area

 

[Animal Mother]

@Rodger From Tremp to Tortosa, the C-13 appears to be the nicer option for views and stuff. I like the old tunnel sand the dams. What are your thoughts on that?

 

[Animal Mother]

Teruel:

Yeah we stayed at a campsite at Albarracin
Wonderful fortitifed village and castle
Well worth a visit and easy trails in the area

Lovely mate, looks worth a visit. Thank you.

 

[Rodger]

Tunnels and dams:

There are numerous Sierras in Spain and the old roads tend to climb over them and the new roads (m/ways) go through them but I did notice that on your return route you leave the E7 (at Sabinanigo) whereas if you stay on it it will take you through the spectacular Somport Tunnel (8.6 kms).

Similarly there are numerous reservoirs and therefore, most times, dams particularly in the southern part of the country as water is a finite resource here and reservoir levels form part of the weather news.

We are just coming to the end of the olive harvest - the mills close at the end of the month - so if it is okay with you, after we finish, I'll take an in-depth look at your rough route and suggest some variations.

What time of year are you planning to make this trip?

Regards,

Rodger

 

[Animal Mother]

Tunnels and dams:

There are numerous Sierras in Spain and the old roads tend to climb over them and the new roads (m/ways) go through them but I did notice that on your return route you leave the E7 (at Sabinanigo) whereas if you stay on it it will take you through the spectacular Somport Tunnel (8.6 kms).

Similarly there are numerous reservoirs and therefore, most times, dams particularly in the southern part of the country as water is a finite resource here and reservoir levels form part of the weather news.

We are just coming to the end of the olive harvest - the mills close at the end of the month - so if it is okay with you, after we finish, I'll take an in-depth look at your rough route and suggest some variations.

What time of year are you planning to make this trip?

Regards,

Rodger

That would be great, thank you.

We are coming in September. I'm currently getting together a more detailed map that I'll send you a link to in about a week or so? Is that ok? I really appreciate it.

 

[Rodger]

Yes that's fine.
September is good as long as you aren't travelling in France on 1st & 2nd as they (all of them!) will be returning from their holidays and therefore the traffic is horrendous.

Cheers

 

[Graham]

The no toll Route we use is as Follows : Calais , Rouen , Evreux , Dreux, Chartres , Orlean, Clermont Ferrand , Millau , Narbonne and then into Spain.
The above route via the A71 / A75 has some steep sections but as long as you have a good power to weight ratio you will be fine and we overnight at Camping Le Clos Auroy south of Clermont Ferrand and just of junction 5 which is very easy to find and is only 3-4 minutes from the Autoroute however it would require a 9+ hours drive in a single day plus stops to get that far....

Exactly the way we go.

Millau is beautiful.

We stop in https://www.dokempu.cz/millau/kemp-camping-cote-sud-103986/
455 avenue de l'Aigoual,
MILLAU 121 00

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place...16a4ecc3fb!8m2!3d44.1020458!4d3.0893458?hl=en

5 minute walk into Millau town centre.

Gra