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Member converts to Bio-diesel

Looking absolutely fantastic :icon-biggrin:

i started putting all kinds of bits and bobs on my watched list on eBay and had a good read of the Bio-Fuel forum link and a look at the systems and bits that they sell and started looking for drums and containers, but a price for a complete set up would be very interesting. Even if it was just for the drum with cone and legs and a kit of all the other major parts to be put together.

I've asked a couple of local users of veg oil what they did with the waste veg oil and it appears the couple I've asked return it to their oil supplier for a discount on what they buy from off of them, so all very much a no go till a source of waste veg oil can be found :think:

to be fair I'd even consider using straight veg as oil as it still represents a saving over taxed diesel :icon-biggrin:
 
nathanrobo said:
Steven, do you have a DI or IDI?
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you know, I have no idea :oops: :shifty: I'm ashamed to say :whistle: I have the 3.0TD 1KZ LandCruiser (not a D4d) and a VW Passat PD TDi 130 :icon-biggrin: Your about to tell me I can't use Bio in one of these arn't you :icon-exclaim: Surely not both :pray: :icon-biggrin:
 
sae70 said:
you know, I have no idea :oops: :shifty: I'm ashamed to say :whistle: I have the 3.0TD 1KZ LandCruiser (not a D4d) and a VW Passat PD TDi 130 :icon-biggrin: Your about to tell me I can't use Bio in one of these arn't you :icon-exclaim: Surely not both :pray: :icon-biggrin:
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Mate, you can use bio in anything, but a petrol car. I read that if you were using WVO / SVO on an IDI it might ring gum, but on a Di it'd definitely ring gum. I'm using bio in an '08 Mini Cooper d with a Dpf. Don't think it gets any fussier with current tech.
 
sae70 said:
Looking absolutely fantastic :icon-biggrin:

i started putting all kinds of bits and bobs on my watched list on eBay and had a good read of the Bio-Fuel forum link and a look at the systems and bits that they sell and started looking for drums and containers, but a price for a complete set up would be very interesting. Even if it was just for the drum with cone and legs and a kit of all the other major parts to be put together.

I've asked a couple of local users of veg oil what they did with the waste veg oil and it appears the couple I've asked return it to their oil supplier for a discount on what they buy from off of them, so all very much a no go till a source of waste veg oil can be found :think:

to be fair I'd even consider using straight veg as oil as it still represents a saving over taxed diesel :icon-biggrin:
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That is the problem I had when trying to source waste oil. :thumbdown:

Hope you manage to source some though. :pray:

I wonder how much they get off their next purchase in return for the used oil? maybe you could offer them more. :think:
 
Ben said:
That is the problem I had when trying to source waste oil. :thumbdown:

Hope you manage to source some though. :pray:

I wonder how much they get off their next purchase in return for the used oil? maybe you could offer them more. :think:
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Thats wht i hve done a couple of times Ben.

STEVEN, You can buy an IBC full of waste veg oil that is corse filtered for around 55ppl. If i couldnt find my own waste then that is a great option to give you a little stock.Ive done that in the past.
 
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Nathan, just had a good look at the finished dispenser and i like it.

I know what you said regarding people saying this would be more than you need to do to get the fuel to a level that can be used and its something i said when i did the first batch. I know that my cruiser would run fine on the fuel after it has been dried.BUT,i also know that it ran fine on wvo once hot. When i sort out for myself im happy to spend the money on the stuff needed to get the fuel to the best i can as there have been alot of you lads who have tried and tested and shared thoughts etc.

As for the shavings part of the process what would be done? Wash the fuel then dry it then run it through the shavings before letting it cool to run through the fuges then final polish?
 
karl webster said:
As for the shavings part of the process what would be done? Wash the fuel then dry it then run it through the shavings before letting it cool to run through the fuges then final polish?
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Bang on mate, hardwood shavings first after drying - not sure what flow I'm going to get through new set up, so I'll probably have to bleed excess flow via spray ring.

Then leave to cool, the longer the better, fuge, then reheat (only to 5 - 10 deg and mix in winteriser with spray bar depending on temps), then dispense via pots.
 
Guys

quick update on first use on my new dispenser, polisher...

Pulled in 200 litres along about 20 ft of hose from a drum that had stood for a few weeks after being washed / dried. I haven't filled the tower yet, so I just centrifuged it and filled the car via the polish pots with the dispensing nozzle.

The centrifuge pulled out a cake of dark brown waxy stuff about 10mm (large 500cc fuge). I'll take a pic and post it in the daylight. But very satisfying, given that the fuel looked clear and bright prior to filtering.

IMG_2489_zps539c2317.jpg
 
How often do you have to empty the fuges Nathan nd how do you do it?

Sounds like good for the job then. Are you going to leave it in the garage then and pull the fuel from your new shed once its processed?
 
karl webster said:
How often do you have to empty the fuges Nathan nd how do you do it?

Sounds like good for the job then. Are you going to leave it in the garage then and pull the fuel from your new shed once its processed?
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Karl, maybe every 400 litres this time of the year. The Fuge on my new kit is brand new, so first use!

To clean just undo the big clamp (only fitted to 500cc & bigger), then slacken the nut on the top, spin off the outer cover, lift the inner rotor bowl off it's spindle. Undo the knurled nut on top of rotor and separate the bowl from the rotor (bit with the jets in). Just clean out and reassemble. Reverse to reassemble, except you need to align marks on inner rotor bowl & rotor (they're dynamically balanced). Beauty is... No consumables!

Ref the kit, I need to make a drip tray with trolley - that would make it more practical. Push it to back of garage use pump to pull in bout 200 litres, polish, dispense & smile :-))

Once you get in front with the fuel it's worth letting it settle for a few days then polishing. This is the fuel that I rushed through polishing just before you collected my processor. I think I said it could use more of a polish.
 
Yet another quick update, decided to check for sure that there was no contaminant left in the fuel, I cleaned the fuge out, and ran it again for another 1/2 hour and guess what there was a decent smear all the way around the rotor bowl.

fugebiosmear_zps4969e8ec.jpg


Then cleaned out again and ran for another 1/2 hour - Perfectly clean this time.

Even the smear of muck in two hundred litres, in my opinion is too much contamination. If it settles out in your tank, it's find it's way to the filter and beyond.
 
After a questions, thought I should add a bit more info about HMPE's and what came out of the fuge after settling.

The question was if after settling in cold weather, a wax cake can be filtered out, will more keep forming?

Answer is that HMPE's form between +2 deg C and - 2 deg C, so if fuel is made and allowed to call to say 3 or 4 deg, and it's then filtered by the centrifuge, any HMPE's and other contaminant left over from washing will come out. That's fine if the fuel is stored and used as the same temperature range as it was filtered.

If your fuel is allowed to settle down to -2deg C it would seem that no further HMPE's will form below this temperature. The fuel then seems to maintain a low viscosity and cold starting etc is improved (although its still worth adding winteriser etc).

In the case of the pictures above, I rushed the last couple of batches as Karl was coming to collect the plant and as my new polishing plant is new, it still needed to be clean (around the weld etc was rusty), this meant that the was cake had a really nasty colour to it rather than the normal cream appearance of HMPE's.

Did another 200 litres after similar settling. The Fuge cake looks a bit more normal now. Added winteriser which means nothing more will wax to about -17 deg.

HMPEcake_zps894fafac.jpg
 
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Took the old girl for an MOT, they put it in the first bay, on the ramp (which seemed to struggle), but then could get the ramp jack to raise it. So they opened up the class 7 bay. On the way round I asked the tester what the emissions were like, "absolutely beautiful" he says (that's the bio).

Anyway it failed, but only because on a visual inspection, the pads had less than 1.5mm on them. Good job that it did fail, the discs are per perfect, no wear lip, another few miles and they would have been scored.
 
Some get on okay with HDPE tanks. I've never tried one, so I can't be sure, but by design there are some limitations. For example spray bar drying (too small an opening), reactions without a co-solvent such as acetone, have found to be more efficient at higher temps (I do it at about 70 Deg), would the tank begin to leak around the heater element at this temp? Most users of plastic tanks react at 50 - 55 deg not so good.

However, playing around with acetone prior to Christmas, my mate Steve and I stumbled on a discovery that led to a greater discovery... To explain, we were interested in faster cleaner washing and theorised that adding acetone would reduce surface tension and release soaps. We were right and found that washing can now be done quickly and with about 20 litres. Since then somebody stumbled on an academic paper which discussed how using acetone with the meth as a co-solvent enabled the oil to exist in solution with the meth and achieve a faster reaction using less lye at a lower temperature.

Early testing of this is yielding unbelievable results. I think that shortly we should be able to do our reactions using a fraction of the lye, at 25 deg, without producing anywhere near the soaps, so really easy to clean and a very quick and clean separation between glycerin and bio - It's not as complicated as it sounds, but it seems that the likely cost per litre increases unless you can recover the acetone, which might not be possible at a low temperature.

So in summary, you could use the kit in the above link, but if you can go to a steel set up it would be better and you could certainly make yourself one for that sort of money out of steel, with somebody else making the main tanks for you. Feel free to call me if you'd like to discuss.
 
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