The people have spoken

goodoldboy Nov 28, 2018

  1. moggy1968

    moggy1968 Well-Known Member

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    I really don’t give a shit about football and don’t care about EU players coming over here, but that statement is as ridiculous as the people flapping about how no one from the eu will be able to come over here and work anymore and vice versa. You may have noticed, or not, that there are also a large number of players from countries outside the EU. Leaving will have diddly squat effect.
     
  2. moggy1968

    moggy1968 Well-Known Member

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    Now now Shane, don’t go letting facts get in the way of good old remain hysteria:laughing-rolling:
     
  3. Bob

    Bob Well-Known Member Supporter I am in ireland

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    Moggy, you are getting increasingly agitated and dismissive of other people's opinions. My point about football was less that it will greatly affect the ability of those players to play, we all know money will bypass any permits etc required. It's more at the psyche of many people who worship at the knees of foreign players all weekend, then spend the work week complaining about immigration and so forth. Where or not you care about football, it can be a barometer of part of society especially the working class. I prefer rugby myself, but not a class thing
     
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  4. Bob

    Bob Well-Known Member Supporter I am in ireland

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    The tone and content of this post is fairly dismissive.. nothing personal Moggy, just the post.
     
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  5. moggy1968

    moggy1968 Well-Known Member

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    Then I’ll delete my response.
    Yes, it’s dismissive because in my view it’s a ridiculous point. EU footballers will not suddenly up sticks and leave.
    It’s dismissive because I dont like football, and I don’t like what is represents in society. I truly don’t give a shit about football. If it was banned tomorrow I would be a happy man.
    I am not becoming ingreasingly agitated or dismissive (which is a personal statement btw). I have always had a low tolerance for bullshit, that hasn’t changed. People need never be in doubt that if I think they’re talking crap I will say so. I don’t dress things up, I say it how it is, if they don’t like that then that’s their problem. I try and avoid being personal about it as long as they do the same but if they want to give me shit, they will get it back in spades.
    That’s always been the case, always will be. It hasn’t changed.
    Where I can I will evidence what I say as I have done at length with some of the posts above. Where people then don’t bother to read those posts properly, lack the ability to understand the fundamentals of history and evidence and continue to try and support a constantly changing unsustainable argument then I do reach the point I will decide they aren’t worth the effort anymore. Likewise where people are deliberately antagonistic but then go off crying playing the victim then I will also decide I’m a bit fed up with their shit. I have better things to do.
    There’s no point if people are that resistant to fact.
    I agree with the point you make in your second post which reads rather differently to the first. It is ridiculous that people bow down to foreign players then moan about foreigners over here. That’s not limited to football though.
    It’s ridiculous, as are a lot of the arguments of the racists and anti immigration brigade, but whilst people of that nature tend to have voted leave it is a crass and simplistic mistake to assume all that voted leave think like that. It’s rather like saying all Muslims are terrrorist.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2019
  6. Bob

    Bob Well-Known Member Supporter I am in ireland

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    Fair enough, your opinion and mine are different. I get that you don't like football, but millions of voters do, so it can offer a window into part of their viewpoint. Just my opinion mind. I'm not sure I agree that arguments I have made lack historical foundation or make an unsustainable argument, but that's the joy of opinion.. it's subjective. I'm aware you are talking about posts in general and not just mine too. I'm happy to concede the agitated point, I don't intend on making personal judgements. Maybe we are all better off talking about Toyotas :D
     
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  7. moggy1968

    moggy1968 Well-Known Member

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    One of the sadder aspects of the referendum is that it has pitched friends and families against each other in arguments that can become increasingly antagonistic. I know members of families that won’t talk to each other anymore because of it. It’s a shame because people that otherwise would probably get on well are falling out over it.
    If I were to meet mark or tony I would probably buy them a pint and enjoy a good nights gassing, just avoid talking about brexit (as I tend to when with friends who are pro Europe!). It just causes too much trouble, it really isn’t worth it.
     
  8. Bob

    Bob Well-Known Member Supporter I am in ireland

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    A pint.. something we can agree on for sure!
     
  9. moggy1968

    moggy1968 Well-Known Member

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    It was about posts in general.
    I was once told by a staff sergeant I was the rudest man he knew. He was shit at his job and, as I do, I left him in doubt my view of that, so rest assured I don’t just save this for the internet! I say it as it is!
    I have occasionally tried to inject some more relaxing humour to the topic when I think it’s getting out of hand, but I guess it’s too emotive for some for that.
    Millions of voters like the sun and the mail as well so I’m not sure they’re a good barometer!
    The Austin metro was the best selling car in the U.K. for several years. That alone is enough proof for me that people don’t make evidence based decisions and we should never have a referendum about anything!! :laughing-rolling:
     
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  10. leeloo

    leeloo Active Member I am in romania

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    let's talk this sovereignty. I still have not heard something concrete.
    For example, a know problem in a lot of places in UK is affordable housing. UK wanted to do something about it but this bastards in Eu said no way in hell..
    Another issue seems to be the NHS. all UK loves it no matter you are labor, tory, remainer.. etc.. , it seems to have some troubles lately, UK wanted to do something but.. the evil EU blocked everything.
    You get the drift.. I would like to see something along those lines.



    And another piece of news related to sovereignty
    Absolutely any international treaty trumps any national law or even the Constitution, if you have it. Not the case of the UK

    So lets say you leave and sign a treaty with Japan, and there it is stipulated that any dispute is resolved by the International Court of Arbitration, or some other court or specially created entity. ( standard practice ) There you will have no say in the rules what so ever.

    Yet you have a problem with ECJ, where you have a judge appointed by you and more importantly, you helped craft and negotiated and had the power to veto any of the laws applied there. But it is fine.
    Brexit will solve it all :)
     
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  11. Bob

    Bob Well-Known Member Supporter I am in ireland

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    I find soccer fans and daily tabloid readers are often one and the same..
     
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  12. moggy1968

    moggy1968 Well-Known Member

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    I would say, I have noted that mark has continued to follow this discussion but has kept his counsel. I have massive respect for that and the self control that demonstrates. I don’t have it, I can’t help being a gobshite :laughing-rolling:
     
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  13. Bob

    Bob Well-Known Member Supporter I am in ireland

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    An Irish slang word Moggy.. how very European of you :/
     
  14. moggy1968

    moggy1968 Well-Known Member

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    The problems with the nhs are nothing to do with the eu. 70 MPs (across all parties) have a financial interest in private healthcare providers so want the nhs privatised. They can’t do that openly so instead they are trying to make it fail so they can gain public support to privatise parts, as they have already done in many areas such as minor injury and outpatient clinics. It will end up like the prison service. When that was privatised the contract went to the very useless group4. On the board of directors of group4 was the then Tory party chairman. This has nothing to do with whether we are in or out of the eu. It’s up to us to deal with that as a country.
     
  15. chadr

    chadr Well-Known Member I am in england

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    You seem to forget that one of the main reasons those factories were setup here in the first place was because we were in the EU. Brexit meant the main raison d'etre for locating the factories in the UK vanished. Yes, the Japan-EU trade deal will have an impact - but the government wanted the same terms (not that they'll get it), so no difference.


    Lord Bamford is in the minority and TBH many believe he has never forgiven the EU for the £40m fines levied for anti-trust breaches in 2000. Sir James Dyson and Sir Jum Ratcliffe are a couple of others who support Brexit - funnily enough, both of them have moved/domiciled abroad. There may be a few business' that gain a benefit from Brexit, that doesn't mean it's right for the majority.
     
  16. moggy1968

    moggy1968 Well-Known Member

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    Nah, that’s Yorkshire mate, you lot just nicked it!:icon-smile:
     
  17. Bob

    Bob Well-Known Member Supporter I am in ireland

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    Or was it imposed on us under colonial rule.. :D

    Now.. I've got stuff to do..
     
  18. moggy1968

    moggy1968 Well-Known Member

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    No I haven’t forgotten that at all, although specifically they were set up here, rather than another eu country thanks to thatcher. However, now the eu have signed a trade agreement with Japan they don’t need them anymore to avoid duty so they are moving manufacturing back to Japan to support their domestic employment market and to other countries where they don’t have trade agreements like the USA and China where their expanding markets are. So while the eu gave with one hand they have taken it away with the other, thank you eu!! As they have been at pains to point out, it has nothing to do with brexit, the reason for putting them in the eu has already been negated, by the eu.
    Of course if we leave and have trade agreements with China and the USA maybe that will change, who knows?
     
  19. Shayne

    Shayne Well-Known Member Guru

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    Is anyone in any doubt the EU has been waging a clandestine trade war with the USA for decades ?

    If chlorinated chicken frightens you then you best stop using tap water , or eating watered crops , or in fact anything that contains or gets washed in water because most tap water is chlorinated .

    We all know the EU relies on scientifically proven bullshit to promote itself as a flower power save the planet soft power hence all the rules that prevent the USA from competing with the European agricultural market were invented for just that reason .

    The arrogance is incredible - you want to quit our club do you well in that case you must first sign a legally binding document that ensures you cannot compete at all with even bankrupt EU countries while continuing to send 100 billion a year to us .

    If you do not agree to this i will punish 28 countries to teach you a lesson confident in the fact that despite the EU having less than 50% support in each of them countries they will continue to obey for fear of suffering what we did to the UK .

    Bullshit , The USA woke up to your nonsense and you picked a fight you can't win . Those who tote themselves as the leaders of the free world have chosen to back Russia and China as allies in their fight against .... erm what ?

    The vision driving all this is world domination , totalitarian control , micro management on a personal scale , increasingly the masses cannot object without being labelled "far right protesters" and shot at , for the good of who .

    If anything at all can turn the EU from its path to oblivion its the rise of the so called far right and the reassertion of sovereign democracy and identity . But like post no deal free Britain its gonna have to take a beating before it can pick itself up and start again .

    Britain is the only member state that can draw first blood and survive , so we have to , not for us but so future generations aren't born into a regime of absolute control .
     
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  20. moggy1968

    moggy1968 Well-Known Member

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    The eu is a protectionist racket which supports inefficient outdated French agricultural and commercial practices.
     
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