Over charging.

[Rodger]

Having drawn a load of blanks when searching for an internal VR alternator, I spoke with I talked with the head tech guy at Simon Holton's dealership in Nottingham when on a recent trip to the UK and he confirmed that that model of alternator is no longer in production and not available.
While I was in the UK I managed to track down a second hand internal vr alternator and spoke with Mike at Robson & Francis who are not only reconditioning same but they had it collected from the seller and will send it to my buddy who is travelling to Spain in his camper at the end of the month. Fantastic service from Robson & Francis. Thanks for the contact, Rich.
I also got the seller to send the vacuum pump etc to my buddy as I then know that the splines will match. I've already, ages ago, been through the bit where the splines are different but I think that was more to do with linking a 40 pump to a 60 alternator.

Regards,

Rodger

 

[moggy1968]

Yes I am intending to get mine reconditioned by them, they seem to know what they are doing. They can I belive also supply the internal regulator for you.

 

[Rodger]

Yes Mike also confirmed that the internal vr alternator is no longer available and certainly implied that they could work round the problem if I couldn't find the right one... but I'd been searching.

My alternator history unknown had been exposed to the elements but Mike gave me a full summary of what needed doing - clear and concise. Excellent people and service.

Regards,

Rodger

 

[Rodger]

My overcharging problems continued until last week. However during the autumn my glow plug system failed - load of sparks through the dash mounted grille (which is a coil mounted behind, acts just like another glow plug).
In December I replaced both batteries, which are mounted under the floor behind the front seats and last week Dave 2000 came here for 3 days to sort the problems.
First Dave established what went where and took the relevant readings.
Secondly we realised that when the truck was modified for winch racing (before my ownership) that the connections were on the primitive side as, at that time, it was competition only. Their primitive nature meant we were encountering excessive resistance on some, if not all, joints.
The truck originally had a 3B engine which has the starter on the left and the alternator on the right, whereas the opposite applies to the 2H. But the wiring had merely been extended to account for this so that wires that originally crossed the bulkhead had been extended and returned under the dashboard.

Dave ran test wires for the new system after we'd fitted the reconditioned (see above post), internal VR alternator including a sensor wire to the batteries cut off switch. Then we wired it all in including the voltmeter and ammeter and I now have an ignition light (not all 40s had them originally). Feed at the batteries 28.4v (tick over) with no fluctuations in the voltmeter when the revs increase.
The glow plug system was re-worked and I now have a glow plug warning light and a system that works as intended except that I am waiting for the 20.5v glow plugs (volts at buzz bar - per the book) to replace the 14v ones.
We removed all the duplicated and excess wiring.

Big thanks to Dave 2000 who did a fantastic job and is good company as well.

Regards,

Rodger

 

[StarCruiser]

Well done Dave, that sounds like a cracking good bit of work done and solving the problem is always a bonus. Great forum. Great people.

 

[Dave2000]

@StarCruiser said "Well done Dave, that sounds like a cracking good bit of work done and solving the problem is always a bonus. Great forum. Great people. "

Thanks, it was an enjoyable (if cold) three days, I think most of the first day was spent unravelling the loom and finding what was connected to what? This allowed me to trace and label cable colour changes and modifications that had previously been made over the years. It also allowed me to label wires that were not connected but may be of use later on, at the same time I also removed the external regulator.

The replacement alternator (with internal regulator) along with the brake vacuum pump fitted perfect, and after running new wires for the new dashboard 'no charge' warning light, and the 'sense' wire correctly fitted at the battery terminal we were good to go. There were plenty of red herrings hiding within the loom often pointing to component failure of the glow plug system but eventually they too were sorted.

I did have a blonde moment though, after fitting new cables and connectors at the starter I asked Rodger to start the engine, but there was no life from the starter, I pulled the cable to the solenoid to find the earlier perfect 28v supply had disapeared!

I knew I had altered the connections on the key switch loom to allow the 40 to retain it's quirky backwards key turn to pre heat the glow plugs which had already burnt out the glow plug warning element, there I found I had not plugged the loom in after soldering in a new connection, alas that was not the issue, lots of head scratching as the turning key did not engage the starter.

As I sat there retracing my steps Rodger walks around and notices that after testing for solenoid supply I had not replaced the cable to the solenoid!! Clicking it in place, we were rewarded with the engine bursting into life, what a pratt!

Talking with Rodger yesterday on the phone, he tells me the 40 since the modifications now starts and runs with the minimal fuss, and charging the two batteries correctly.

Some minor odds and ends are still to be sorted on the 40, they will be sorted in a few weeks when Rodger and Corinne come over to stay at mine and watch one of Spains biggest carnivals. I must say it was a rewarding few days had by all, even Corinne braved the cold tidying up after us and making copious amounts of tea and feeding us, a good result alround.

Regards

Dave

 

[StarCruiser]

Well done Dave. I can relate to all of that especially leaving stuff disconnected when all logic disappears and leaves my brain cell too.

My usual party piece was to leave the circuit breaker switched off on the circuit I was working on.

 

[Dave2000]

Well done Dave. I can relate to all of that especially leaving stuff disconnected when all logic disappears and leaves my brain cell too.

My usual party piece was to leave the circuit breaker switched off on the circuit I was working on.

I was having to copy and paste your earlier quote, but now the site has started working again for me, it can be a pain.

Ah you also have the one brain cell! I reckon if I had two they would argue with each other.

I think when your embarking on such a project the first day or so sussing it out and then putting in the correct wires and connections you remain sharp, when it all works you then relax and make a silly mistake like not reconnecting something.

It is very rewarding though when everything is working as it should, I am now turning my attention back to the solar panel and controller mods on my 80, since the old panel did not fit the new roof rack, I have been sans solar.

Take it easy,

Regards

Dave

 

[StarCruiser]

My solo brain cell does incredibly well considering how much it has to contend with. I think it’s probably at least 8 times overclocked running on pure methane with inter cooling through my ears. I’m surprised it’s lasted so long so I do forgive it the occasional brain fart.

 

[Ben Stratford]

Well done Dave and Roger
Could you advise what type of new alternator you have please?

 

[Dave2000]

Well done Dave and Roger
Could you advise what type of new alternator you have please?

I will leave Rodger to answer that Ben, it was an elderly style I have not seen before however it had been reconditioned and looked like new. It did mount up correctly. For reference something I found odd was the brake vacuum pump was not lubricated via an oil feed into the pump and gravity back to the sump, instead the oil was fed into the alternator and then fed into the vac pump, the gravity return was as per norm.

I do recall the 'T' shaped connector connections were not in the typical order. I had to identify via cable size, and used a DMM to pickup the correct connections. I am unsure if that was as per original design, diagrams/pictures are a bit thin on ground.

Regards

Dave

 

[Rodger]

Hi Ben,

The alternator did not have any part numbers on it and per my post #81 above they are no longer available new but what I can tell you is that I found that they were only fitted to the last year or so production - I think the truck mine came from was an 87/88.
The vacuum pump is much smaller as part of it is incorporated into the alternator, as Dave said.
I will photograph it and look through my records and see if I can throw a bit more light on this.

Regards,

Rodger

 

[Rodger]

Hi Ben,

The alternator and vacuum pump changed in 08/87.
82-87 alternator 27020-68021 or 27020-68040 both 25A
vacuum pump 29300-68010
Post 08/87 alternator 27020-68130 (30A) 27020-68150 (40A cold spec)
vacuum pump 29300-54050

Photos to follow

Regards,

Rodger

 

[Rodger]

The later vac pump is so much smaller then the original type but the oil feed is into the alternator, so if you track on down you will need to get the vacuum pump as well.

Regards,

Rodger

 

[StarCruiser]

I wonder who it was that one day at work thought ‘I know, won’t it be a great idea to combine the alternator and vacuum pump’?

 

[Rodger]

I wonder who it was that one day at work thought ‘I know, won’t it be a great idea to combine the alternator and vacuum pump’?

Shame they didn't think of it earlier as that would have saved some of us a load of trouble!

 

[Ben Stratford]

Hi Ben,

The alternator and vacuum pump changed in 08/87.
82-87 alternator 27020-68021 or 27020-68040 both 25A
vacuum pump 29300-68010
Post 08/87 alternator 27020-68130 (30A) 27020-68150 (40A cold spec)
vacuum pump 29300-54050

Photos to follow

Regards,

Rodger

Great info thanks Roger,
Im hoping to find a spare internal vr 40a alternator to then have refurbed and fitted then do the same to the current 30 amp one to keep as a spare. Been looking for ages but no luck. May have to make some enquires to japan

 

[Ben Stratford]

Great info thanks Roger,
Im hoping to find a spare internal vr 40a alternator to then have refurbed and fitted then do the same to the current 30 amp one to keep as a spare. Been looking for ages but no luck. May have to make some enquires to japan

My current alternator part number is 27040 - 68030 for reference

 

[StarCruiser]

Shame they didn't think of it earlier as that would have saved some of us a load of trouble!

I’m surprised as my thoughts were that it’s a waste to replace a perfectly good vacuum pump when an alternator dies and have the extra hassle of pipes and oil etc when changing it not to mention extra space constraints and more work to refurb the unit.

 

[Rodger]

Well yes in principle... except that to date I've had three alternators and the pumps and splines are all different, hence why I got the seller of this alternator to sell me the pump as well.

@Ben Stratford It may be worth contacting the guys in Holland as they do a lot of 60s.

Regards,

Rodger